my rear brake job experience with ecs tuning

Atcfan

Active member
Joined
Sep 23, 2015
Location
Central square ny
TDI
2003 jetta 5 SPEED
I have a 2003 Jetta that was long over due for a rear brake job including pads rotors and calipers. I order the calipers from ecs tuning because they came with new caliper mounting brackets too part #2597711. when i order the calipers i see in the description" For vehicles with VIN from 9M-Y-012 500 only". I email them and ask them to see if the caliper brackets will fit my 2003 car and they respond yes they will fit. Now i point out that after i called ecs today to complain about the poor quality parts they have replaced that message and replaced it with **Note: The carriers included may not fit your application, and the original caliper carriers must be used.** I order everything that i need from them and idparts and within a few days my boxes arrive in the mail. I tackle removing the old brakes from my car with ease with no broken bolts including the dreaded caliper bracket allen head bolts by using an easy out to remove them. I then grab the new brackets and try to install my new pads from idparts but notice that with the new hardware installed on the brackets that there was no way the pads will fit. I even tried the old pads and they would not fit. so i decide to file down the brake pads to fit the shiny new brake caliper bracket. i get the bracket torqued down and when i go to install the caliper that i just put the brake line on with banjo bolt and fresh copper washers that i can't put a socket on the bolt that secures the caliper to caliper bracket but a open end wrench will fit. With my old calipers i could remove them with a socket. Seeing how i just filed down my brand new pads so they would fit the new brackets i figured i would be determined to make these parts work. i remove the banjo bolt and brake line and put my torque wrench on the caliper bolts to torque them down to 25 ft lbs. I get to about 15 ft lbs and it almost feels like the bolts are stretching while i am tightening them and of course i feel SNAP. The darn bolt just snapped off inside the brake sliding pin. *** so i try the other bolt and it feels like it is doing the same thing so i stop. I called up ecs and told them that they will send me new bolts and a sliding pin for free. They assured me that the parts will ship soon but ill probably end up going to Napa to get the replacement bolts. i am probably done with ordering parts from ecs.
 

Genesis

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 26, 2003
Location
Sevier County TN
TDI
'03 Jetta Wagon
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=76249

That's fronts -- sorry, wrong reference.

If you stretched both beyond yield (you did) then obviously you reefed them beyond the correct amount of torque..... :)

Did the new bolts come with threadlocker on them? They should and they should be the same thin-head bolt style.

How did you counterhold the pin? I have a thin little wrench that is also used with my brake rewind tool to wind the rear pistons back in (to hold the inside nut); it has a small slot for the pin flats to hold with. My regular-size open end wrenches will not go on; they're too thick. Those rear bolts that go into the pins aren't very beefy and their heads are also small; they're allegedly "must replace" as well and come with thread-locker on them when new but you CAN re-use them with a bit of blue loctite if you don't damage them when taking them off and they're not corroded.

I see "myturbodiesel" says 26 ft/lbs (48 for the carrier bolts, which is looks right) too... hmmm...

If the pads didn't go on then I'm suspicious of the pistons being fully retracted. You can't push them in without the tool to rotate them at the same time; that's part of the parking brake mechanism in the caliper.
 
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Atcfan

Active member
Joined
Sep 23, 2015
Location
Central square ny
TDI
2003 jetta 5 SPEED
I used some needle nose vise grips to hold the nut on the end of the pin. I guess ill go to napa tomorrow and buy more. Its just frustrating
 

Genesis

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 26, 2003
Location
Sevier County TN
TDI
'03 Jetta Wagon
Yeah, something's not right here.. there shouldn't be any sort of issue like this, nor with the pads fitting correctly either..... gotta wonder if you got the wrong parts all the way around.

(I see you were referring to loading the pads into the bracket before you mounted the caliper over the top -- I'm definitely thinking "wrong parts" here now...)
 
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scurvy

Good Ol' Boy
Joined
Feb 21, 2006
Location
Chicago IL USA
TDI
2006 Golf
so i decide to file down the brake pads to fit the shiny new brake caliper bracket.
...
i can't put a socket on the bolt that secures the caliper to caliper bracket
...
determined to make these parts work
...
The darn bolt just snapped off inside the brake sliding pin
Dude. Slow down.

You have lost all situational awareness. The warning signs, according to many industries and nicely summarized by the US Coast Guard are:

• Confusion or gut feeling
• No one watching or looking for hazards
• Use of improper procedures
• Departure from regulations
• Failure to meet planned targets
• Unresolved discrepancies
• Ambiguity
• Fixation or preoccupation

If something doesn't fit, STOP. You're doing it wrong, or you've got the wrong parts.

I've done brake jobs on tens of cars and never once had to file brake pads to fit. Or had tools not fit on new parts. Or had new parts snap off.

It sounds like you got the wrong parts and you are bashing the **** out of them trying to get them to work.

Work smart, not hard.
 

sawmilldon

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 19, 2016
Location
WA
TDI
2004 Wagon
Scurvy nailed it. Whenever I get parts that do not seem to go together, I stop and pour another beer and stand around pondering for a while.

First rule is 'Do No Harm".
 

UhOh

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2014
Location
PNW
TDI
2000 & 2003 Golf GLS (2005 Mercedes E320 CDI)
Well, at least we're not talking about IP, TB, pistons and rings or 01m parts! I don't think that the damage is going to spread very far here. Of course, the car isn't likely going to go very far either.
 

KLXD

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 22, 2009
Location
Lompoc, CA
TDI
'98, '2 Jettas
Took one look at that post and couldn't make the effort to read it.

Guess I missed an entertaining one.
 

belome

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 8, 2010
Location
Mid MI
TDI
2002 Jetta GLS TDI 5-speed
The hardest part of being a backyard mechanic is knowing when you should hire a professional.
 

BobnOH

not-a-mechanic
Joined
May 29, 2004
Location
central Ohio
TDI
New Beetle 2003 manual
The hardest part of being a backyard mechanic is knowing when you should hire a professional.
Yes, modern brakes are easy to work on, but they're mission critical. Having read the top part of this thread it seems the wrong parts were used. How, why, or who is too hard to tell on this interweb thing, and won't help now.
Hopefully the OPs car is fixable.
 

sawmilldon

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 19, 2016
Location
WA
TDI
2004 Wagon
I worked at an aircraft maintenance outfit long ago, and our private saying was that we would fix the customers plane if it took every penny they had.
 

Ol'Rattler

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 3, 2007
Location
PNA
TDI
2006 BRM Jetta
I have a 2003 Jetta that was long over due for a rear brake job including pads rotors and calipers. I order the calipers from ecs tuning because they came with new caliper mounting brackets too part #2597711. when i order the calipers i see in the description" For vehicles with VIN from 9M-Y-012 500 only".

I email them and ask them to see if the caliper brackets will fit my 2003 car and they respond yes they will fit. Now i point out that after i called ecs today to complain about the poor quality parts they have replaced that message and replaced it with **Note: The carriers included may not fit your application, and the original caliper carriers must be used.** I order everything that i need from them and idparts and within a few days my boxes arrive in the mail.

I tackle removing the old brakes from my car with ease with no broken bolts including the dreaded caliper bracket allen head bolts by using an easy out to remove them. I then grab the new brackets and try to install my new pads from idparts but notice that with the new hardware installed on the brackets that there was no way the pads will fit. I even tried the old pads and they would not fit. so i decide to file down the brake pads to fit the shiny new brake caliper bracket. i get the bracket torqued down and when i go to install the caliper that i just put the brake line on with banjo bolt and fresh copper washers that i can't put a socket on the bolt that secures the caliper to caliper bracket but a open end wrench will fit.

With my old calipers i could remove them with a socket. Seeing how i just filed down my brand new pads so they would fit the new brackets i figured i would be determined to make these parts work. i remove the banjo bolt and brake line and put my torque wrench on the caliper bolts to torque them down to 25 ft lbs. I get to about 15 ft lbs and it almost feels like the bolts are stretching while i am tightening them and of course i feel SNAP. The darn bolt just snapped off inside the brake sliding pin.

*** so i try the other bolt and it feels like it is doing the same thing so i stop. I called up ecs and told them that they will send me new bolts and a sliding pin for free. They assured me that the parts will ship soon but ill probably end up going to Napa to get the replacement bolts. i am probably done with ordering parts from ecs.
I had to enter paragraph breaks so that I could read your post without getting a headache.

So much fail. You should stop "butchering" you car car before you cause even more damage. Really? you ground the pads down so they would fit the carriers. Really? There's a lot of other fails that have been covered already..............

You won't feel so great about the money you saved by doing the job yourself (incorrectly) when your brakes fail and kills someone.
 

KLXD

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 22, 2009
Location
Lompoc, CA
TDI
'98, '2 Jettas
Thanks for going to that trouble so I could read it. Still wasn't easy.

I figger when his brakes fail he'll just blame ECS.

Basic rule to when playing mechanic. If it doesn't fit don't put it on even if the vendor says it fits. YOU have the parts in your hand and the car in front of you not the vendor.
 

Ol'Rattler

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 3, 2007
Location
PNA
TDI
2006 BRM Jetta
Da Nada. My other pet peeves is people posting extremely large and/or blurry pics. You speak the truth about "playing mechanic".

That means if things even start to go pear shaped a persons need to put the tools down and learn why before proceeding. Wrong part? It is the person turning the wrench's responsibility to install the correct part not the vendors. My crystal ball says that the OP is about to black list his local Napa's. :rolleyes:
 

Atcfan

Active member
Joined
Sep 23, 2015
Location
Central square ny
TDI
2003 jetta 5 SPEED
Ok so I took few days off from working on the car so not to do more damage. I ended up getting fresh brake pads and ordered calipers from a different vendor. Everything bolted on without an issue. I am in the process of boxing up the wrong calipers and returning them. I am curious what vehicle these calipers are supposed to fit.
 

Ol'Rattler

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 3, 2007
Location
PNA
TDI
2006 BRM Jetta
Easy. Just Google the part number. Works like a champ.

So you know the correct way to adjust the E-Brake is to first apply the foot brake several times to seat the pistons inside the calipers and then apply the release the hand brake several times to adjust the E-Brake mechanism inside the calipers.

If you do hand brake first and then foot brake you can get the handbrake mechanism adjusted wrong which could cause the brakes to drag and the applied position of the hand brake lever to be wrong.

If you do end up with dragging brakes, you will have to remove the calipers and wind the E-Brake mechanism clockwise back into the calipers. After that it would be to put the calipers back on and do the adjustment procedure correctly. We can walk you through that if you need help.
 
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jokila

Vendor
Joined
Dec 3, 2004
Location
Houston, Texas
TDI
2003 Jetta GLS, Manual
I had to enter paragraph breaks so that I could read your post without getting a headache.

So much fail. You should stop "butchering" you car car before you cause even more damage. Really? you ground the pads down so they would fit the carriers. Really? There's a lot of other fails that have been covered already..............

You won't feel so great about the money you saved by doing the job yourself (incorrectly) when your brakes fail and kills someone.
Thank you for making paragraphs of the word diarrhea. I finally decided to actually read his post now. Agree on all your points too.
 

jokila

Vendor
Joined
Dec 3, 2004
Location
Houston, Texas
TDI
2003 Jetta GLS, Manual
Ok so I took few days off from working on the car so not to do more damage. I ended up getting fresh brake pads and ordered calipers from a different vendor. Everything bolted on without an issue. I am in the process of boxing up the wrong calipers and returning them. I am curious what vehicle these calipers are supposed to fit.
Hope they take them back all boogered up as you did.
 

UhOh

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2014
Location
PNW
TDI
2000 & 2003 Golf GLS (2005 Mercedes E320 CDI)
You're already up on a "professional" brake job (front) that was done on the wife's car (by PO). A shop put on crap parts and, I'm almost certain, stripped one of the caliper pins (I discovered this when I went to lube them up- had to helicoil the knuckle). One of the calipers eventually started hanging up. Replaced everything with the best parts available (calipers, OEM from VW- ouch!): no tolerance for misbehaving brakes!

Go cheap and you may not make it home!
 

snakeye

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2009
Location
Montreal, Canada
TDI
2003 Jetta and Wagon, GLS 5sp
Seeing how i just filed down my brand new pads so they would fit the new brackets i figured i would be determined to make these parts work.
For those who didn't read, this quote pretty much sums up the entire thread. :D

Ok so I took few days off from working on the car so not to do more damage. I ended up getting fresh brake pads and ordered calipers from a different vendor. Everything bolted on without an issue. I am in the process of boxing up the wrong calipers and returning them. I am curious what vehicle these calipers are supposed to fit.
City Golf? I did my cousin's City Golf's rear brakes last summer, and bought some pads that were supposed to fit on a MK4 Golf. They did fit, but so tight that they definitely wouldn't slide. I ended up filing them, too. Don't know whether they were the right part or not (they were TRW not some cheapo brand), but it wasn't worth the hassle to research and exchange the parts considering how little I had to file.

Edit: nvm my issue was the carrier/pads not the caliper
 

BobnOH

not-a-mechanic
Joined
May 29, 2004
Location
central Ohio
TDI
New Beetle 2003 manual
It's not unheard of to file down the ears, though it's usually the other surface that is rusted.Never had to do it on a veeDub, but recently did on wife's Honda. Cleaned the mounting bracket with wire brush, needed a small grinder to get rust, so I just filed the pads.
 
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