Out of my depth with door problemsuppliers

Hi folks,
Just got my 2002 1.9 Tdi pd estate (on air ride )
I love the engine. Always been a petrol fan and use a Mk1 Octavia VRS with a few engine mods as my daily.

The previous owner had a very 'never really bothered me' attitude towards faults the car has developed and I just can't be like that.

I've hit a wall with the doors and windows and their behaviour. I really would appreciate some guidance please and thanks for reading this far!

Symptoms

Drivers door
Sporadically opens on fob / works fine with the key
Window willike travel a random distance before stopping and the switch needing to be pressed again
No illumination on dash warning light or interior light when the door is opened

Drivers rear
Dead
Changed the loom and the window operated fine on its own switch for 2 minutes
Tried the locks and drivers switch = nothing
Tried it's own switch and dead again

Passenger front
Works as should off fob
Window operates fine off its own switch / sporadic off the drivers switch
Dash and interior light both illuminate when the door is opened

Passenger rear
Same as passenger front in every sense except the window operation from the drivers switch is a lot worse.

Tail Gate
Operation is spot on including interior light and dash warning illumination.

I've run my vagcom on her and below are the faults that have come up.
Thanks for taking the time to read all this and I really to appreciate any guidance offered.

Cheers

Tom

VCDS-Lite Version: Release 1.2
Thursday, 13 July 2017, 20:53:34:58627


Chassis Type: 1J - VW Golf/Bora IV
Scan: 01,02,03,08,15,16,17,19,22,29,35,36,37,39,46,47,55,56,57,75,76

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine Labels: 038-906-019-AXR.LBL
Controller: 038 906 019 FF
Component: 1,9l R4 EDC 0000SG 1449
Coding: 00002
Shop #: WSC 01266
VCID: 60B3C680F35B
WVWZZZ1JZ2W663500 VWZ6Z0B0009071
2 Faults Found:
16955 - Brake Switch (F): Implausible Signal
P0571 - 35-00 - -
18080 - Coolant Fan Control 1: Open or Short to Ground
P1672 - 35-10 - - - Intermittent
Readiness: N/A

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 1C0-907-37x-ABS.LBL
Controller: 1C0 907 379 J
Component: ABS FRONT MK60 0103
Coding: 0001025
Shop #: WSC 01266
VCID: 311573C4E831
2 Faults Found:
00283 - ABS Wheel Speed Sensor; Front Left (G47)
003 - Mechanical Failure - Intermittent
00283 - ABS Wheel Speed Sensor; Front Left (G47)
003 - Mechanical Failure - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags Labels: 6Q0-909-605-VW5.LBL
Controller: 1C0 909 605 A
Component: 27 AIRBAG VW51 01 0004
Coding: 12855
Shop #: WSC 01266
VCID: 22378C88BDD7
1 Fault Found:
00588 - Airbag Igniter; Driver Side (N95)
32-00 - Resistance too High

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments Labels: 1J0-920-xx5-17.LBL
Controller: 1J0 920 926 C
Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRS. RB8 V20
Coding: 01422
Shop #: WSC 00000
VCID: 2A2764A8C5E7
WVWZZZ1JZ2W663500 VWZ6Z0B0009071
5 Faults Found:
01336 - Data Bus for Comfort System
37-10 - Faulty - Intermittent
01336 - Data Bus for Comfort System
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent
01332 - Door Control Module; Passenger Side (J387)
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent
01333 - Door Control Module; Rear Left (J388)
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent
01334 - Door Control Module; Rear Right (J398)
49-00 - No Communications

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.LBL
Controller: 6N0 909 901
Component: Gateway K<->CAN 0001
Coding: 00006
Shop #: WSC 01266
VCID: F09336C0A3BB
5 Faults Found:
01336 - Data Bus for Comfort System
37-10 - Faulty - Intermittent
01336 - Data Bus for Comfort System
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent
01332 - Door Control Module; Passenger Side (J387)
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent
01333 - Door Control Module; Rear Left (J388)
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent
01334 - Door Control Module; Rear Right (J398)
49-00 - No Communications

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv. Labels: 1C0-959-799.LBL
Controller: 1C0 959 799 B
Component: 1W Komfortgerát HLO 0003
Coding: 00259
Shop #: WSC 01266
VCID: 361F40D8015F
9 Faults Found:
01336 - Data Bus for Comfort System
37-00 - Faulty
01334 - Door Control Module; Rear Right (J398)
49-00 - No Communications
01333 - Door Control Module; Rear Left (J388)
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent
01332 - Door Control Module; Passenger Side (J387)
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent
01331 - Door Control Module; Driver Side (J386)
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent
01299 - Diagnostic Interface for Data Bus (J533)
49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent
01331 - Door Control Module; Driver Side (J386)
49-00 - No Communications
01332 - Door Control Module; Passenger Side (J387)
49-00 - No Communications
01333 - Door Control Module; Rear Left (J388)
49-00 - No Communications

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 56: Radio Labels: 1J0-035-18x-56.LBL
Controller: 1J0 035 186 B
Component: Radio BNO 0004
Coding: 01401
Shop #: WSC 31414
VCID: 243B8A90A7C3
1 Fault Found:
00856 - Radio Antenna
36-00 - Open Circuit

End --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Simply put, the door mechanisms are known to have issues. Search for 'stupid $3 door switch' to have some background. I would definitely assume the switch has gone bad in the drivers door.

Cheers Steve

OK
So I have a new door lock module. Plugged it into the loom before ripping the whole door inner off.
1st win so far! The dash warning now illuminates and the puddle light comes on so that means the car is seeing the door.
Am I right in thinking the window motors play apart in the whole working of the doors too?
Just wondering if the window motor is dead in terms rear then the door lock wont function?

Thanks again

Tom

Considering all the CAN bus errors to doors, I suspect that you have a bad module that was wedging that bus. Note that in these cars, power is not sent door to door to run the windows, but rather commands on the comfort CAN bus to tell the specific door module what to do. Considering that all problems you report seem to have some involvement of the drivers door module, I think you are on a good track . . .

Thanks for that tadawson.
So I feel like I'm heading down the right path now.
What in your opinion would cause the windows to behave erratically off the drivers switch but fine off their own switches? I fitted a new switch bank so now I'm down to loom or motor?
Thanks again.
Feeling a bit more positive about stripping these doors down now.

Might want to take a look at the ground down there behind the side kick panel.

Bagged wagon said:

Thanks for that tadawson.
So I feel like I'm heading down the right path now.
What in your opinion would cause the windows to behave erratically off the drivers switch but fine off their own switches? I fitted a new switch bank so now I'm down to loom or motor?
Thanks again.
Feeling a bit more positive about stripping these doors down now.

Click to expand...

The window commands, switch to module are local in-door, but must come across the CAN bus from the drivers door, again pointing to something screwing up that CAN bus.
Again, the switches do *NOT* switch power to the window motors - they create CAN commands telling the module in the door to do so. Thinking of this as a data network and not a bunch of parts traditionally wired would be a better way to view modern car electronics . . .

Wow, ok lots of useful info there thanks.
This is all a bit of a learning curve for me right now.
So going off what you said do you belive the ccm is faulty causing the signal to be corrupted to the individual modules?
Also does the drivers switch send the signal to the ccm to be fed back into the drivers door window module as that is behaving badly too?

Checked the Ground connection Uhoh but I'll give it another once over to make sure.

Thanks both for your time.

Hard to say. The change with the new drivers side module made me think it might have been the culprit, but did not catch an update of the module being fully installed, and if anything else improved. You might try disconnecting each module on the bus one at a time, clearing codes, and seeing what comes back . . .

OK I'll do that next and report back.
Thanks

OK so
I've plugged a new loom into the drivers a post connection. Plugging it into the original drivers window has no effect the windows are still sporadic in their operation.
I also have 2 window motors one for drivers front and one for drivers rear.
Now when I plug the new drivers front motor in it only operates the drivers window none of the windows work at all!? But and here's the what's really now sent me crazy if you press the lock button on the switch bank it only fires the drIvers rear door which has been dead up until now!!!! Plug the original motor back in and it goes back to the same as the beginning. Dead drivers side rear door and erratic windows from the the other 3.

Can these window motors be programmed or are they designed to only work with one ecu / ccm?

I don't have a clue now.

Thanks

I believe there are different versions of the motors and that they cannot be mixed (model year issue).

Ohhh balls.
So this window situation could be down to mismatched motors uhoh?

I guess the next question is where do I go from this now? With that many part numbers out there.
Do the motors all have to match part numbers to work but can be off any mk4 or do they have to match and have to be off my particular setup?
Thanks again

That's not a viable solution my friend lol

Bagged wagon said:

I guess the next question is where do I go from this now? With that many part numbers out there.
Do the motors all have to match part numbers to work but can be off any mk4 or do they have to match and have to be off my particular setup?
Thanks again

Click to expand...

Time to do a bit of legwork. Look through one of the on-line VW parts sites, I use 1stvwparts.com. May or may not be that the motors are different: I'm just saying what I "thought" I had heard- I seem to recall someone really struggling with something like this and it turned out it was due to a mismatch of motors.

Just tried 3 different motors in the loom mate and none of them work... put the old one back in and it bahaves badly but at least it shows sign's of life.

Identical part numbers to the original?

Appears that there's a difference between 2dr and 4dr, otherwise no difference between model years (that I can see) [NOTE: this is for the US market; I wouldn't expect the European market to be a whole lot different, other than those countries that drive on the wrong side of the road]:

http://1stvwparts.com/2000-volkswagen-jetta-tdi-diesel_1.9_l_4-transaxle_standard_trans_speeds-electrical-front_door-9277560/

http://1stvwparts.com/2001-volkswagen-jetta-tdi-diesel_1.9_l_4-transaxle_standard_trans_speeds-electrical-front_door-9277560/

http://1stvwparts.com/2002-volkswagen-jetta-tdi-diesel_1.9_l_4-transaxle_standard_trans_speeds-electrical-front_door-9277560/

http://1stvwparts.com/2003-volkswagen-jetta-tdi-diesel_1.9_l_4-transaxle_standard_trans_speeds-electrical-front_door-9277560/

Perhaps there's something else in the above that could account for differences/problems.

tadawson said:

Identical part numbers to the original?

Click to expand...

Tawdoson I dont even know what the original Part number is I did some research for a 2002 74kw 1.9tdi mk4 and the part number i got for front right
= 1C1 959 802 A
the motor thats in there at the moment
= 1C2 959 802 A

i figured the previous owner had put the wrong motor in and that was causing the corruption of data but the new motor doesn't do anything

Below is the different fault codes and the different behaviours going through 3 motors im more confused now than when i began especially with the the rear right door!!!



NO MOTOR PLUGGED IN No part number

VCDS-Lite Version: Release 1.2
Tuesday, 18 July 2017, 20:42:42:58627
Control Module Part Number: 1C0 959 799 B
Component and/or Version: 1W Komfortgerát HLO 0003
Software Coding: 00259
Work Shop Code: WSC 01266
VCID: 361F40D8015F
Additional Info: Steuergerát Fahr. antwortet nicht
Additional Info: 1C2959801A Beif. antwortet nicht
Additional Info: 1C0959811A 1W Tõrsteuer.HL KLO 0004
Additional Info: Steuergerát HR antwortet nicht
5 Faults Found:
01336 - Data Bus for Comfort System
37-00 - Faulty
01331 - Door Control Module; Driver Side (J386)
49-00 - No Communications
01332 - Door Control Module; Passenger Side (J387)
49-00 - No Communications
01333 - Door Control Module; Rear Left (J388)
49-00 - No Communications
01334 - Door Control Module; Rear Right (J398)
49-00 - No Communications



ORIGINAL MOTOR PLUGGED IN Part number = 1C2 959 802 A

(FRONT AND PASSENGER LEFT WINDOWS WORK)
CENTRAL LOCKING WORKS ON THE SAME 3 DOORS
REAR RIGHT = DEAD (WINDOW AND LOCK)

5 Faults Found:
01336 - Data Bus for Comfort System
37-00 - Faulty
01334 - Door Control Module; Rear Right (J398)
49-00 - No Communications
01331 - Door Control Module; Driver Side (J386)
49-00 - No Communications
01332 - Door Control Module; Passenger Side (J387)
49-00 - No Communications
01333 - Door Control Module; Rear Left (J388)
49-00 - No Communications



NEW MOTOR PLUGGED IN (NO WINDOWS WORK) Part Number = 1C1 959 802 A
NO CENTRAL LOCKING
4 Faults Found:
01336 - Data Bus for Comfort System
37-00 - Faulty
01331 - Door Control Module; Driver Side (J386)
49-00 - No Communications
01332 - Door Control Module; Passenger Side (J387)
49-00 - No Communications
01334 - Door Control Module; Rear Right (J398)
49-00 - No Communications



RANDOM GOLF MK4 MOTOR PLUGGED IN. PART NUMBER = UNSURE
(NO WINDOWS WORK)
REAR RIGHT DEAD DOOR = CENTRAL LOCKING WORKS!!!

3 Faults Found:
01336 - Data Bus for Comfort System
37-00 - Faulty
01331 - Door Control Module; Driver Side (J386)
49-00 - No Communications
01334 - Door Control Module; Rear Right (J398)
49-00 - No Communications



I'll have a look through those links now UHOH cheers

Thanks both for the amount time you're investing in this.

The part number isn't marked on the old motor?

tadawson said:

The part number isn't marked on the old motor?

Click to expand...

The original / old motor hashow 1C2 959 802 A on it mate.

Using this site https://m.bestpartstore.co.uk/7114489

It says 1C1 959 802 A is the part number .
So I purchased a motor with the recommended number and that motor produces nothing... really thought I'd cracked it until I plugged it in.

UhOh said:

Appears that there's a difference between 2dr and 4dr, otherwise no difference between model years (that I can see) [NOTE: this is for the US market; I wouldn't expect the European market to be a whole lot different, other than those countries that drive on the wrong side of the road]:

http://1stvwparts.com/2000-volkswagen-jetta-tdi-diesel_1.9_l_4-transaxle_standard_trans_speeds-electrical-front_door-9277560/

http://1stvwparts.com/2001-volkswagen-jetta-tdi-diesel_1.9_l_4-transaxle_standard_trans_speeds-electrical-front_door-9277560/

http://1stvwparts.com/2002-volkswagen-jetta-tdi-diesel_1.9_l_4-transaxle_standard_trans_speeds-electrical-front_door-9277560/

http://1stvwparts.com/2003-volkswagen-jetta-tdi-diesel_1.9_l_4-transaxle_standard_trans_speeds-electrical-front_door-9277560/

Perhaps there's something else in the above that could account for differences/problems.

Click to expand...

Had a look through these buddy. They're 2 door with the odd "sedan" thrown in... is a sedan a 4 door or estate?
Can't really find a 4 door front right part number in that lot.
This is hard work lol

Anything not listed as a 2dr is, therefore, a 4dr (figure this as side doors; never mind rear, hatchback/wagon doors). It's likely that there's some physical difference that would probably preclude them from bolting in, but I don't know for sure- you probably need to do more research.

SOLVED
SOLVED
SOLVED

Absolutely buzzing. Have now regained full central locking / warning lamps / interior lights / correct window function on all doors including the dead one! And also one touch.
Thank you Tadawson and UHOH for consistently coming back to provide your knowledge and opinion.
So glad I had you guys to bounce ideas off and ask questions. Awesome.
If anyone reads this that feels like they have the same issues
1st off use vagcom and the measuring blocks function to assess that the ccm (module 46) is talking and giving command's.
If you find that it's behaving as it should
Check part numbers and make sure if it worked before that you use the exact same part number or if like me was left with no clue, source a motor with the right part number for your vehicle making sure the last letter is the same as on the other units. In this instance min was 'A'
Check the usual giveaways that the micro switches and looms are breaking down (no warming lamp on dash, no interior light, alarm misbehavin etc)
I have had replaced 2 looms and 2 door lock modules and one window motor.
The window motor is a silent pain in the a$$ as the rear motor was actually talking the cmm as though it wanted to be the main control motor so the person before me had bolted the wrong one in. Coupled with a suspect loom in one door, one damaged loomy in another. 2 definite failed locking modules the cmm was left faulting out on all doors.
Well thanks again guys really appreciate your help.

Glad to hear it! Makes sense, though . . . both trying to talk on the same ID, corrupting data on the bus . . .

This also points out how much fun it isn't when you inherit someone elses problems . . . had they left things alone, this would have been pretty clear in the first place!

Great job! And what a relief to beat this.

As if it's not enough to have to deal with aging vehicles, but to also add in BAD "repairs." Monkeys and wrenches shouldn't be mixed! Hoping that this will be the last of such discoveries for you.

tadawson said:

This also points out how much fun it isn't when you inherit someone elses problems . . . had they left things alone, this would have been pretty clear in the first place!

Click to expand...

That coupled with leaving jobs to stack up. I can't live with things not working as they're intended. Will I use that rear window enough to warrant the amount of effort and stress it has caused... probably not but by leaving that motor in the previous owner had unknowingly masked 4 other problems which had some pretty major repercussions mainly the alarm going off at all times of the day and night and the massive power consumption from the battery. He said he knew nothing about the problems but did give me another battery with the car hmm.

I've found a few other "issues" along the way UHOH but for now all is good and I don't have to go to bed scouring the Internet for clues and hunting down tracking number's. Problems like this for someone like me become all consuming until they're put to bed. I don't speak to the wife for 2 days

In North America the door modules and window motors got an update around 2001/2002.. depends on your car. You need to make sure you're using the right era device. As the window motor is part of the CCM logic, putting in the wrong one causes things to not work.