muffler what would you guys reccomend

jefem

Active member
Joined
Jul 5, 2001
Location
barrie
thinking about getting a new muffler so my jetta can breath better. i have heard you guys talking about the techtronics and borla id like to hear some feed back on who has what and how they like it and if their neighbors are complaining about the sound


I dont want a loud muffler so if somone could reccomend somthing that is close to the stock sound but still better performance that would be great
 

TDIracer17

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 20, 2001
Location
Ann Arbor, MI
You should get a muffler-ectomy. I highly reccomend it. you can tell a difference in the sound but it isnt anything to get the fuzz following you. i have had my muffler off for 2 weeks now and i am really pleased. and it is very cheap compared to a cat-back or even just a muffler. i paid $70 for mine to be taken off but i have heard of people only paying $30. If i were you i would get a muffler-ectomy.

TDIracer17
Chris

2001 Golf GL TDI
1984 Rabbit GTI
 

BIGJOHNO

Veteran Member
Joined
May 2, 1999
Location
Frozen Tundra
TDI
2010 Golf (Black) mine; 2011 Golf (UGM) hers
Um, grand total should be $0. Get a hand saw and hack that bad boy off. Then get some straight pipe and clamp it down. Still have not put the straight pipe on, but I imagine it should not be too expensive.

John
 

Turbo Steve

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 11, 2000
Location
.
Mufflectomy 101

Get rid of that muffler! You don't need a doctor's degree or fancy license to perform this simple procedure. It's much easier than the title suggests.

1. On the A-4's, simply undo the stock muffler clamp / hanger rods at the front and rear of the OEM muffler (two - 13mm nuts on each clamp).

2. Next, twist and slide the muffler towards the rear and off the vehicle. It should easily come
off without much trouble if your ride is fairly new.

3. Now take your trusty tape measure and get an accurate measurement of the inside and outside diameter of the uncovered OEM exhaust pipe.

4. Go to your local Pep Boys or Trak Auto parts store with these measurements and purchase a $5.00 3' piece of galvanized exhaust pipe to replace the section where the OEM muffler was.

5. Next, measure the 3' piece of pipe before purchasing it to ensure it will fit over or inside the open OEM exhaust pipe (whichever you prefer, but over is better. This is why it's important to premeasure the inside and outside diameter of the pipe before going to the parts store.)

6. Now, temporarily place the 3' straight pipe inside / over the open OEM exhaust pipe - marking the end of the 3' pipe where you need to cut it off on the end, near the rear bumper facia. (Some folks have shortened the pipe and others like myself have slid the piece over the OEM exhaust pipe far enough to make things work without cutting.) Running the tailpipe about 1 1/2" past the bottom of the bumper facia will result in the tailpipe being exactly flush with the center of the facia (when looking down).

7. Last of all, use the two OEM clamps with hanger rods to hold the 3' pipe in position, using the two OEM 13mm nuts to reinstall each clamp on the straight pipe.

8. Start the engine and listen to the twirling sound of the Turbo emulating from the new tailpipe.

9. Be sure to wipe the silly
off your face before letting your spouse drive the car because she will probably not know the difference or actually be pleased with the slightly new sound (if she finds out).

Note: Leave the catalytic converter in place! Removing it subjects you to a hefty fine and will only give the TDI engine a 1 HP increase - It's definitely not worth it.
 

jefem

Active member
Joined
Jul 5, 2001
Location
barrie
ok sounds easy enough and its just the right price.... but im puzzled about one thing what are the ppl who are buying catbacks and such getting that they wouldent get with the straight pipe. And also i know if you take the cat off your fined but i thought you could be fined for no muffler also??
 

Turbo Steve

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 11, 2000
Location
.
My TT cat-back system is stainless and 2 1/2" ID, instead of 2" and it comes with a stainless Borla free flow muffler as well. It was installed over a year ago before the mufflerectomy procedure was common knowlege.

Basically, I simply double insulated the entire exhaust system (allows spent gasses to exit the engine faster - keeping the turbo cooler) and later removed the Borla muffler and installed a straight pipe and fancy 3 1/2" exhaust tip on the end.



 

jetmann

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 29, 2001
Location
the abyss
TDI
2k2 Jetta
TS, how much louder than stock is the mufflerectomy'd TDI at idle or low-load acceleration?
 

Turbo Steve

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 11, 2000
Location
.
The sound is hardly any louder at all. Some Forum member's wives have not even noticed a difference.

..... And no, these wives were not deaf!
 

Turbo Steve

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 11, 2000
Location
.
Metro:

Special exhaust wrap from New Dimensions is used to double wrap the entire system - from the turbo to the tailpipe. Aluminum foil duct tape was then applied to help seal the heat in.

Insulating the exhaust system does several things:

1. Keeps the spent hot gasses flowing faster than an OEM setup.

2. Spent gasses quickly cooldown as soon as they hit the exhaust manifold and cooler gasses flow SLOWER - keeping a logjam of gasses in your engine longer.

3. Faster flowing hot gasses keep your turbo cooler because they are exiting the combustion chamber faster than normal - also carrying more heat from the turbo along with it.

4. As spent gasses exit more quickly, backpressure is reduce and this allows the turbo to spinup more quickly, further eliminating any lag-time.
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Ok, ok. Since Steve let the cat out of the bag, I'll take credit.

I'M the one whose wife doesn't know about the muffler surgery on the Jetta. Mine is slightly different. I had it cut at the recommended point after the cat and before the rear axle. So, the job is a little bit more complex than what others are doing and my pipe length is longer and includes more bends and 3 flanges.

From an earlier post of mine:

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>I just had my Muffler modified this morning. I spent more time trying to figure out the "noise" and didn't have as much time to check out the performance changes, but my initial reaction is the same as Turbo Steve has described.

It is more rev happy. I can tell down low in the RPM range. And, it's like adding the Piperpanel or Cone and "feeling" the difference immediately.

Now, for the noise issue. I now understand what people have been trying to describe and thought I might give it a shot as well.

It is SLIGHTLY louder, but I'll try to give the new sound some reference point for all of you.

If you open the windows you can't hear the "noise". If you ride with the windows up, with no radio on, then you can hear the difference.

When you turn on your radio and listen at normal voumes, you can't hear the lack of a muffler.

If someone rides in your car, and has never heard your muffler before, they'd never know it unless you asked them to listen for it.

The first thing the guy said to me when he started the car after putting on the straight piece of pipe was " it's really quiet". That is a quote. I'm sure he was expecting it to be much louder.

They also welded a flange onto my OEM muffler in case I wanted to re-attach it.

These guys are in Glenn Burnie, on Ritchie Highway. It's a Meineke muffler shop 410-768-4500. Tom Campbell is the owner. Nice guy.

Lito


One more thing, he did 2"Diameter, not 2.5 and used Aluminized Steel and Not Stainless for $150.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I hid the OEM muffler in the basement and the next day, she had to take the car for the entire day. Not a word about the missing muffler or noise. Don't know when I'll tell her. Maybe when she finds the one in the basement.


[ July 17, 2001: Message edited by: tongsli ]
 

jefem

Active member
Joined
Jul 5, 2001
Location
barrie
ok so what do when do when it comes time for emissions test? do they look under there when you get it tested? or do we slap it back on for the day?

im in canada and i think not sure yet because i havent had to get it tested ontario excludes cars till they are 2years old. so in november im gonna have to get tested? the mufller shouldent have effect on the emissions right its the cat that has effect on that?

[ July 16, 2001: Message edited by: jefem ]
 

whitebelly

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2000
Location
Kearny, NJ U.S.A.
TDI
2013 JSW
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jefem:
ok so what do when do when it comes time for emissions test? do they look under there when you get it tested? or do we slap it back on for the day?[ July 16, 2001: Message edited by: jefem ]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

as i posted earlier (see above) i hooked my straight pipe up with clamps specifically so that i could re-hang my muffler when it's time for inspection. here in the US, they won't test my car for emissions, but they will use a mirror to look under the car for a sealed exhaust system.
to re-hang the muffler, i bought a plumbing pipe joiner from the hardware store (for 2" pipe) for about 5 bucks. it's made of rubber so it's flexable, and uses standard o-ring clamps. the temperature limit is 250 degrees farenhieght. it's not a permanent solution, but when it comes time to get tested, they'll never know.
 

2GreenTdi's

Veteran Member
Joined
May 28, 2001
Location
Sootland
JeffM,
Do the muff-ectomy!!!!
I have a TT 2.5w/Borla and I like it but if I had found Fred earlier I would have gladly spent my money on FAT A** injectors and instead trimmed a little off the tail. Yes I
would make an easy reinstall for inspection modification. If you want to go all out do the 3" pipe all the way back but you'll need to do some pipe bending. TurboSteve's wrap at the same time would be a good idea also.
 

Craig

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 8, 1999
Location
Kitchener, Ont., Canada
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jefem:
ok so what do when do when it comes time for emissions test? do they look under there when you get it tested? or do we slap it back on for the day?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Jefem, in Ontario the current emissions testing for diesels is an entirely subjective test. The rev the engine and check for visible smoke. Any mods (such as fat injectors) that cause more smoke than stock should cause concern. Replacing the muffler with a straight pipe is not a mod that will effect this test.
 

Smokescreen

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 21, 2000
Location
Alberta, Canada
TDI
JettaTD, 1992, Tornado Red
I talked to a guy who had mentioned that he was going to wrap his gasser w/turbo and he said that you have to make sure the turbo can handle extra heat that is not absorbed by the manifold or the downpipe-exhaust. In this case extra heat in the turbo would transfer its heat to the oil causing engine temps to rise.

I can see that if the exhaust wasn't wrapped the heat is transferred out of the turbo to the downpipe-exhaust etc like having huge 'heatsinks' on the turbo thus lowering its temperature.

OTOH, I can also see how if you wrap the exhaust the heat is kept in the exhaust gasses and exits out of the turbo etc,...all the points mentioned previously by Turbo Steve.
I guess my question might be can the turbo exit the hot gasses faster than it heats itself up along with the engine. I really don't want to spend an hour putting wrap on only to find out the EGT's are making the engine run hotter.

If someone like Oldman with lots of turbo history could provide some input or we could get some EGT's before and after exhaust wraps that would really clear this up for me.
 

Turbo Steve

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 11, 2000
Location
.
While racing engineers might wrap their turbos, I recommend against it and instead, prefer to keep things safe by only wrapping from the downpipe on.

Don't be fooled into thinking that wrapping the downpipe or exhaust system makes the turbo run hotter; it's just the opposite!



Please read the following very carefully. Insulating the exhaust system does several things:

1. Keeps the spent hot gasses flowing faster than an OEM setup.

2. Spent gasses quickly cooldown as soon as they hit the exhaust manifold and cooler gasses flow SLOWER - keeping a logjam of burnt gasses in your engine longer.

3. Faster flowing hot gasses keep your turbo cooler because they are exiting the combustion chamber faster than normal - also carrying more heat from the turbo along with it.

4. As spent gasses exit more quickly, backpressure is reduced and this allows the turbo to spinup more quickly, further eliminating any lag-time.

5. Insulated catalytic convertor helps this emissions device run hotter, thereby decreasing the chances of it plugging up.

6. In summary, a turbocharged diesel does not need backpressure to operate efficiently with plenty of torque off the line (like gas engines do). An insulated straight through or high flow system is the best of both worlds.

Wrapping - Special exhaust wrap from New Dimensions was used on my system to double wrap the entire exhaust - from the turbo to the tailpipe. Aluminum foil duct tape was then applied to help seal the heat in, thereby keeping the gasses flowing faster so the engine and turbo can run at lower temps.
 
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