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TDI Power Enhancements Discussions about increasing the power of your TDI engine. i.e. chips, injectors, powerboxes, clutches, etc. Handling, suspensions, wheels, type discussion should be put into the "Upgrades (non TDI Engine related)" forum. Non TDI vehicle related postings will be moved or removed. Please note the Performance Disclaimer.

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Old August 20th, 2009, 12:12   #1
MCM_FR
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Default Leon ARL 2256v presentation (strange noise problem)

Hello,

Eventhough I have been reading this forum for a long time, I have never created a post.

So here is my presentation, I come from northern Spain (sorry for my poor english), my car is a 2003 Seat Leon Fr, ARL. Recently I upgraded my turbo to a 2256v, alfa source.

Apart from the turbo, I also have a complete milltek exhaust system (63mm), fuel cooler, boostvalve, upper an lower strut braces, Bilstein PSS9 suspension, and other minor mods.

The car has has been remapped by "correcaminos", a friend of mine from Spain, the final remap, is as I wanted it, not smoky. And from my point of view the final result is really satisfactory.

Now for the problem. At full throttle, from 2000 to 2500 I have a kind of Shhh shhhh noise, coming from the turbo, is discontinuos, and at higher revs it disappears. I have tried to upload the video on youtube, but I havenīt been able to .
Any idea about this noise? It doesnīt sound healthy at all.

Thanks a lot for your help.

I will post some installation photos of the turbo.
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Old August 20th, 2009, 12:17   #2
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Does it sound anything like this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCj6Spwl1CU
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Old August 20th, 2009, 12:50   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vwmikel
Does it sound anything like this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCj6Spwl1CU
Well, my TDI sound is quite far from a Skyline, but yes, the shhh, shh, sound in my car is similar to what can be heard on "second 53-55, at a much lower frecuency on my car.

*** is that? too much boost requirements? the fact is that at high revs it doesnīt sound like that. Suggestions are welcomed!!
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Old August 20th, 2009, 13:00   #4
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That seems to be rather light compressor surge. It sounds like the airflow is unstable, so you either need to ask for less boost, or more boost. I know someone is going to criticize me for saying to ask for more boost, but there are cases where you can sidestep the surge limit by increasing the request (and therefore shaft speed).
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Old August 20th, 2009, 13:25   #5
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At last I have been able to upload the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oi_TnvtMu3k

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-Ewss_6h-M

Could it improve if I strangle internally the "red pipe" that goes from the turbo to the intercooler? I mean, to reduce the area, similar to the exit on the original 1749
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Old August 20th, 2009, 13:32   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MCM_FR
At last I have been able to upload the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oi_TnvtMu3k

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-Ewss_6h-M

Could it improve if I strangle internally the "red pipe" that goes from the turbo to the intercooler? I mean, to reduce the area, similar to the exit on the original 1749
I would think that reducing that pipe diameter might actually make it worse because it would increase backpressure. That is a strange sound in those videos but I do hear a little bit of surge for sure.
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Old August 20th, 2009, 14:40   #7
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Hmm..Do u hear it around 3rd gear, bout 2k - 2.8k @ rpm, when boost shows bout 22psi? Sound disappear when bout 3k on rpm..?

Then say 4th gear, also bout 2k - 2.5k @ rpm, boost show bout 18psi & up & the sound appear, then disappear when pass 3.5k @ rpm?

When driving> u hear that sound, then u let go the accerator immedietly, u hear the fluttering sound?Like some wrx after the bov *Pssssttt!!, then the dd..drrr..roo..o... x2 sound?

If 1st to 4th gear you whack till redline every gear, you are unable to get that sound right?Well, urm, maybe some time u get it in 4th..
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Old August 21st, 2009, 05:36   #8
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hello Miguel!

requested boost is 1,7 bar @ 2300 rpm and 1,9 bar from 2500 to 3500.

this sound appears with requested 1,7 bar but quietly. with 1,9 bar it sounds high. could it be too much shortened the actuator's rod?

Last edited by correcaminos; August 21st, 2009 at 07:24.
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Old August 21st, 2009, 09:53   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vwmikel
I would think that reducing that pipe diameter might actually make it worse because it would increase backpressure. That is a strange sound in those videos but I do hear a little bit of surge for sure.
Hi, I totally agree with you, but as the OEM 1749 has that restriction at the turbo exit, I thought that it might help.






Thanks for you help vwmikel! I hope with your help will be able to get rid of this noise
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Old August 21st, 2009, 10:06   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TorqueRules
Hmm..Do u hear it around 3rd gear, bout 2k - 2.8k @ rpm, when boost shows bout 22psi? Sound disappear when bout 3k on rpm..?

Then say 4th gear, also bout 2k - 2.5k @ rpm, boost show bout 18psi & up & the sound appear, then disappear when pass 3.5k @ rpm?

When driving> u hear that sound, then u let go the accerator immedietly, u hear the fluttering sound?Like some wrx after the bov *Pssssttt!!, then the dd..drrr..roo..o... x2 sound?

If 1st to 4th gear you whack till redline every gear, you are unable to get that sound right?Well, urm, maybe some time u get it in 4th..
You have perfectly described what happens. I would say that the noise starts at 1900-2000 until 2500rpm, when boost exceeds 20-22 psi (1.4-1.5) bar.

I have tried this morning to mantain boost at 20 psi, to check if the noise appeared or not, but it is not easy to keep the pressure at a fixed value with the gas pedal.

Do you have the same problem?

Quote:
Originally Posted by correcaminos
hello Miguel!

requested boost is 1,7 bar @ 2300 rpm and 1,9 bar from 2500 to 3500.

this sound appears with requested 1,7 bar but quietly. with 1,9 bar it sounds high. could it be too much shortened the actuator's rod?
Hi Javi,

I will make a trial with the other remap you prepared for me at 23 psi (1.6 bar) and let you know if the noise is still there. For me the problem is not the noise, the problem is that it sounds as it will soon brake down.
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Old August 21st, 2009, 10:23   #11
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Bellow you can find some pictures (I have used imageshack, I hope this is fine for this forum ) of the turbo upgrade experience. It was done by m0nch0 a wellknown forum member of Areavag, an spanish vag forum.

He lives 300 miles away, in Santiago, Iīm from Burgos.

We get up very early in Spain...




I stopped in a circuit on the way to Santiago to record some logs... the last
with the 1749.






EGR radiator removal



We took out EGR and and intake pipe for cleaning with and ultrasonic machine.





Something to store..

The EGR had been "cleaned" by me 12000 miles ago.



1749 still inside

Last edited by MCM_FR; August 21st, 2009 at 10:30.
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Old August 21st, 2009, 10:23   #12
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Bellow you can see the new turbo, bought in Portugal. It is sold with an adaptation to fit on tdiīs. But is not completely P&P as some things needs to be modified (exhaust, and pipes)








We decided to install the turbo from the upper side, so we had to remove some parts.











Last edited by MCM_FR; August 21st, 2009 at 10:31.
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Old August 21st, 2009, 10:24   #13
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First problem, the miltek downpipe didnīt match with the turbo, so we had to "move up" the exhaust


New lubrication pipe







As we had removed the EGR radiator, we had to join the pipes.



What a wonderful tool!



Finished!



63mm milltek Down pipe, and the old and new flange.





Last edited by MCM_FR; August 21st, 2009 at 10:37.
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Old August 21st, 2009, 10:24   #14
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Intake manifold and EGR after the ultrasonic clean










Downpipe already welded to the new flange.



This was necesary to reach the turbo exhaust level













Last edited by MCM_FR; August 21st, 2009 at 10:41.
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Old August 21st, 2009, 10:38   #15
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Minor modifications were required to fix the inlet pipe





We removed the return pipes from the EGR radiator





We modified the bracket that supports the turbo, is not very refined but it was fairly late...





Engine bay was washed the next morning.




Summary of the return trip!








Hope you like the pictures!

Last edited by MCM_FR; August 21st, 2009 at 10:49.
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