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General Automotive General automotive discussion. This is intended to be a discussion about other not VW and Diesel cars you may have or interested in.

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Old January 3rd, 2018, 16:17   #4141
dremd
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No regrets at all on my Leaf, however none of my local Nissan dealers will even fix a tire on it. My nearest Leaf dealer is 80 miles away. I havenít really had any issues, but I do have a pair of recalls that Ií deferring due to inconvenience.
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Old January 5th, 2018, 10:13   #4142
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Originally Posted by tikal View Post
I have been following this subject of EVs with interest as I see them a potential good value for short trips in an mostly urban environment with certain tradeoffs of course. I am not in the market to buy a car but if I was my main concern with buying one of these used 'bargain' electrical vehicles such as the Fiat 500e would be serviceability in states that do not sell them (50 -2 = 48). Ok I understand they have, relative to an ICE, less things that can break or need maintenance, right? What if an something electronic (or electromechanical) goes bad in a Fiat 500e in the Houston area, is there an EV guru to go to fix it? What if a driver of a Fiat 500e gets in an accident in the same metropolitan area, then what?
So I buy a three year old EV for $9K; what risks I will be taking if I want to keep the car for another 8 to 10 years in an area that does not sell/service such a vehicle?
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Originally Posted by bhtooefr View Post
tikal: So, under warranty, Fiat will fly an electric specialist to your dealer if needed, as far as I know.

Outside of warranty... I think they still will, but you'll pay for it.

However, there are a fair amount of independent EV/hybrid specialists (and unlike TDI specialists, it's a growth market, across multiple brands), and there are a lot of used 500es that have left the California/Oregon area. So, independents are likely to figure out how to fix these, just like independents figured out each successive generation of TDI.
There are several Fiat dealerships around the country that are certified to work on the 500e. Fiat has been doing a pretty good job of getting dealerships trained and supplying them with the proper equipment to handle off-lease 500es that are migrating from California and Oregon.
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Old January 5th, 2018, 11:27   #4143
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Don't just consider the service, although that matters too dremd and I can attest to (local dealers refusing to so much as touch an EV even for non-EV issues).

Someone hit my wife's eGolf a few months ago and we took it to a local body shop who assured us they had done work on EVs before. They stripped it down until they got to the rear panel and had to contact VW regarding shutting the high voltage down, which required special tools they didn't have.

So they put it all back together and gave it back to us to start the process over with a new body shop. The only body shop certified to work on electric golfs in the San Diego area is in North County--a little over 150 miles away from where the car was. Currently, the car is under the 3 year VW Care so VW towed it to their service center without charging us and then my insurance company agreed to tow it back. The time from the car being hit and being returned was a little over two months.

So be mindful that it's not just service you have to consider, which probably won't be a frequent concern, but minor fender benders, etc. can't be repaired by average shops currently either. Also, keep in mind the EVs on the market right now are still undergoing research and development. There have been numerous recalls regarding the eGolf, one of which was a serious and dangerous issue of the system shutting down at high speed. Like dremd, I saved up a short list of recalls before I finally made the trek into my closest dealership who could do them (about 120 miles each way) because we basically had to give up the car for a whole week to negotiate the distance and service time.

I've already questioned the claim of offsetting the costs related to EVs (oil changes, brakes, etc.) and non-EVs, but ignoring everything else and just considering a single tow for a few hundred miles each way is going to erase any savings gained from not having to do traditional services on the car.
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Old January 5th, 2018, 18:48   #4144
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I've already questioned the claim of offsetting the costs related to EVs (oil changes, brakes, etc.) and non-EVs, but ignoring everything else and just considering a single tow for a few hundred miles each way is going to erase any savings gained from not having to do traditional services on the car.
Well, I suppose it depends on how long you intend to own the EV. My Audi A4 costed me ~$25,000 in gasoline, oil services, brakes, fuel pump, water pump, timing chain, etc, (stuff that wouldn't apply to my EV) over the course of 100,000 miles. If I'm able to put 100,000 miles on my EV, and assuming it stays as trouble-free as it's been, the savings will speak for themselves. Lot's of "if's", for sure but I took a similar chance on my JSW when I imported it from the US. No Canadian VW dealership would honor warranty on a US car. A catastrophic failure with my JSW would have also necessitated a trip to Seattle.

In the event I have to tow the Mercedes to Seattle; I'd just look at it as an unscheduled vacation. My wife loves Seattle. I do too. When life serves lemons, make lemonade.
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Old January 7th, 2018, 09:23   #4145
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Thanks for the feedback Oilerlord; sounds reasonable what you say. In a few years metro areas like Houston and the like will have more possibilities to service these used EVs.

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Originally Posted by Oilerlord View Post
You sound like me about six months before I bought my EV

You're correct to weigh the advantages offuel savings against the risks of non-existent serviceability in your area (I did). I'm quite sure that I have the only Mercedes B250e within 1000 miles of where I live. There is also a zero chance of getting my local Mercedes dealership to service any of the electric bits in the car because they have neither the equipment or the training to do so.

So, if my battery, drivetrain, charging system, or related electrical bits break down; worst case means I'm towing it to Seattle. Not too big of a deal as I have other cars to drive, and can borrow a truck to tow it if the need arises.

I accepted that risk mostly because of the faith I have in my car's Tesla supplied battery & drivetrain, and because EV's have an overall track record of stellar reliability.

Like you, I'm also looking out 8 to 10 years with my car. I already know that there is a VERY small market for a car like mine in my area, but because I intend to keep it for a long time, resale value doesn't much matter because I will have already saved the price I paid for the car in not burning gasoline, and not having to pay for services like oil changes and related engine maintenance. With regenerative braking, I may never need to replace the brake pads either because they rarely get used.

Though your concerns are certainly valid, from my experience; I think you're reading too much into them. Notwithstanding the car's electric drive system, the rest of the car can be serviced at your local Fiat dealership. I really believe that a Fiat 500e will be far more reliable than it's Fiat 500 gasoline counterpart. Much more fun to drive too.

Hope this helps.
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Old January 7th, 2018, 09:46   #4146
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Thanks for the feedback Oilerlord; sounds reasonable what you say. In a few years metro areas like Houston and the like will have more possibilities to service these used EVs.
Austin is pretty progressive when it comes to EV's, solar, etc. There should be service options there earlier than just about anywhere else in Tx.
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Old January 7th, 2018, 11:35   #4147
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As an example of serviceability, I had an oops my first winter with the EV. I didn't realize that the washer fluid that shipped with the car wasn't rated down to -30C - until the hose that feeds the rear window froze, and had to be replaced. My local Mercedes dealership had no problem taking my $180 for that one.
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Old January 11th, 2018, 14:24   #4148
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https://www.bmwcca.org/roundel/profe...-closed-course

This is a very good write-up of the Model 3 from an unlikely place.
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Old January 11th, 2018, 18:15   #4149
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You can now place your order for a Workhorse W-15 pick-up.
https://cleantechnica.com/2018/01/11...w-open-public/
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Old January 11th, 2018, 22:46   #4150
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You can now place your order for a Workhorse W-15 pick-up.
https://cleantechnica.com/2018/01/11...w-open-public/
Iím very tempted to put down a $1,000 deposit on one.
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