Lets talk adapters

Ok, I have a 02 TDI drivetrain that I want to swap into ANYTHING and I figured that I would start a thread for Where and what you can get adapters for

We know Acme makes tdi adapters for Toyota and Sammy... http://www.acmeadapters.com/

Hpa is "making" the adapter for Jeep http://www.hpamotorsports.com/tdijeep.htm

Kennedy adapter for Vw type 1 trans http://www.kennedyeng.com/vw_por.htm


CAD drawings of TDI engine http://www.haywood-sullivan.com/vana...wing_small.pdf
Anything else?

For 4x4 stuff that is all that i know off without making your own adapter. If you want a rwd setup, the W58 trans out of a Mk 3 non-turbo supra with bolt up using the acme adapter.

kennedy engineering makes adapters for this engine...but I think they are limited to bug and bus transmissions

It would be nice to get the bolt, dowel pin, and crank centerline dimensions in a drawing form. For both vw engines and various gearboxes. I've seen some online for things like chevy 350's. With those drawings, I could easily machine a plate on the mill with digital readout.

Anyone have vw bolt pattern dimensions? Or seen them online?

Not easy to pick those measurements off an existing engine or gearbox.

Ski in NC said:

It would be nice to get the bolt, dowel pin, and crank centerline dimensions in a drawing form. For both vw engines and various gearboxes. I've seen some online for things like chevy 350's. With those drawings, I could easily machine a plate on the mill with digital readout.

Anyone have vw bolt pattern dimensions? Or seen them online?

Not easy to pick those measurements off an existing engine or gearbox.

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No, but I have an old 020 trans case half I could send you if you think you could make the measurements.

Thats what im looking for! I think we need to get stuff going so that we see less posts of "Here is my project - I wont share the measurements with you guys because im think about making kits....."

Then they never make anything

what I want to see is a bell housing that adapts the vw block to both r and w series toyota trannies and incorporates a rear facing VW TDI starter with appropriate flywheel

Ski in NC said:

With those drawings, I could easily machine a plate on the mill with digital readout.

Anyone have vw bolt pattern dimensions? Or seen them online?

Not easy to pick those measurements off an existing engine or gearbox.

Click to expand...

The industrial TDI cad drawing is floating around out there. It has the same pattern as the passenger car TDI engines. I also found someone on yotatech.com who had measured the crank pattern:

There are drawings here:

http://www.haywood-sullivan.com/vanagon/TDI/tdi_engine_cad_drawing_small.pdf

It is already linked through one of the Vanagon swaps on the sticky up top.

Wow! Thanks GeEkBoY that really helps!

GeEkBoY said:

There are drawings here:

http://www.haywood-sullivan.com/vanagon/TDI/tdi_engine_cad_drawing_small.pdf

It is already linked through one of the Vanagon swaps on the sticky up top.

Click to expand...

right click, save as..

Thanks!

Here is the adapter plate dimensions to build the VW-Toyota plate. It is from yotatech.com, its from Flash319's post, the same post that Reddok got the flywheel picture from. The larger holes are for the Toyota, it is to be made from 3/8" plate and all dimensions are in inches.

I am in the middle of a slight modification to the acme adapter for the toyota transmission. I have two minor issues that I want to address for my current truck and or my next project. The acme kit comes with an oilite pilot bushing which is okay but I would much prefer a pilot bearing. The second issue I have is how close the vw engine sits to the firewall when the transmission is in its stock location.

So, my plan is to build basically the same adapter plate made out of 3/8" steel using the dimensions in the previous post and add 1" spacers between the plate and vw engine and box it all in with 1 by 1/4" steel. The flywheel will also need to be pushed back an inch as well by making a 1" spacer that slips over the vw crank and mates to the toyota flywheel on the other side. This spacer would also be bored to fit the stock pilot bearing for the toyota transmission input shaft. This would eliminate boring the toyota flywheel to fit the vw crank but the bolt hole would still need to be drilled. This spacer will have to be within .002" on all surfaces.

So far I have machined the flywheel spacer minus the bolt holes. Finding long enough bolts shouldn't be an issue but I have not looked into this yet.
I can start posting pics if anyone is interested.

I am defiantly interested to see this spacer set up. Just a thought though, would it not be easier to just move the trans forwards an inch? I believe Rockwell did this with a 1.6td. The way my engine sits (without moving the trans) i have about 3/4" clearance in the tightest spot, which is the edge of the valve cover. Right below this, the firewall tapers back and there is about 2-3" of clearance. All i did was modify a aluminum coolant flange to exit 90 degrees and it still fits with lots of room. I still am not sure about how much the engine will rattle around, but i think it will be ok. I will admit though if you can get the spacer setup to work, it will be very nice and clean. Anyways, my apologies for the thread jacking, back to adapter plates!

Good luck,

Luke

There is enough play in the driveshafts to move things up a bit for sure but you start running into issues like your shifter hitting the stereo and heater controls when you shift into third or fifth. This can be easily remedied by bending the shift lever a bit but I like the idea of keeping everything in its original location. It also makes getting replacement parts easy since they are all stock. The motor just needs to move ahead a pinch. My two cents. I'll see if I can get some pics tomorrow.

Tanks guys, this is really looking good! I hope more people will get what they need here. I would really like to make a tdi to jeep ax-15 adapter. I have a feeling that HPAs price is going to be way too much for me.

410onefour- I would love to see some of those pics if you want to post them!

I think moving the flywheel back a inch is a bad idea. Because your are added a joint between the flywheel and the crank you may have balance and aliment problems.The joint will give the flywheel more deflection and stress on the longer flywheel bolts which will be a weak point to begin with.I could out if left field other can chime in sorry for the hijack.I think it would be less problems just move the trans forwared.

or make the adapter so you bolt it to the crank, then bolt the flywheel to the adapter 36* rotated, and make yourself a NEW TDC mark on the flywheel. no worries with extra long bolts, you can use two sets of factory type flywheel bolts to hold it on, and it will be no different than if you were bolting the flywheel to the crank. just make the adapter out of similiar material as the crank is so that the threads are nice & strong. no aluminum. too buttery soft for this application.

Growler said:

or make the adapter so you bolt it to the crank, then bolt the flywheel to the adapter 36* rotated, and make yourself a NEW TDC mark on the flywheel. no worries with extra long bolts, you can use two sets of factory type flywheel bolts to hold it on, and it will be no different than if you were bolting the flywheel to the crank. just make the adapter out of similiar material as the crank is so that the threads are nice & strong. no aluminum. too buttery soft for this application.

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This is what I am doing. I was considering using heli-coiled holes in an aluminum adapter, but I think I'd rather just play it safe and use steel.

onlyn8v said:

Tanks guys, this is really looking good! I hope more people will get what they need here. I would really like to make a tdi to jeep ax-15 adapter. I have a feeling that HPAs price is going to be way too much for me.

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Check out Babyrattlers CJ conversion thread on here. He says he will be selling his kits to adapt the TDI to an AX-15. But don't expect it to be cheap. Just the materials alone are worth $200 - let alone all the machine work.

I got a chance to take some pics today. Here's some shots of the crank spacer. No holes drilled yet but should get to that this weekend.



It's made out of mild steel. The bolts are not as easy to source though. I have only found the size I need in a 8.9 grade where the factory bolts are 12.9. Going to a longer bolt I definitely want a similar grade at the least. Hopefully I can find something for a reasonable price but if I have to I might contact ARP and see what they have.

Could you not countersink the holes so you could use the factory tdi bolts? I think that is the way I'm going to try and do mine.

I don't know if there would be enough meat left to bolt up the flywheel to the spacer once you countersink the holes. Maybe if you had allen head bolts to keep the countersunk diameter down to a minimum, but I'm right back to sourcing out bolts. I'll do some research tomorrow. Like I mentioned in the previous post, I'm sure I can get arp to supply me with exactly what I'm looking for if that is the only thing holding me back.

Any of you Suzuki guys know if a G10 (3 cylinder) has the same bolt pattern on the transmission end as the four cylinder engines (G13?)

A friend and I are looking really hard at a $150 Metro with a dead engine, and I have a nice old 1.5D that's in need of a car...

Reddok said:

Check out Babyrattlers CJ conversion thread on here. He says he will be selling his kits to adapt the TDI to an AX-15. But don't expect it to be cheap. Just the materials alone are worth $200 - let alone all the machine work.

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Thats exactly what Im talking about in this thread. Everyone says here is my project but im keeping the details of the adapter to myself because im thinking of making kits.... But they never do and the info is lost.

Price is relative. To me, $200 in materials is getting off easy to prototype something. Sure time is money but if your doing it for yourself, do you really care?

Ive seen Babyrattlers swap, and it looks great.

I've come up with a relatively easy way to adapt basically any transmission to any engine as long as you have both engines sitting there. It requires a lathe to make a few very simple pins to help find centerlines in bolt holes, dowels and crank ends. I'll try and steal the wifes camera again today to help explain things a little better. I'm quite happy to share anything I have learned about conversions. No secrets here!

TurbinePower said:

Any of you Suzuki guys know if a G10 (3 cylinder) has the same bolt pattern on the transmission end as the four cylinder engines (G13?)

A friend and I are looking really hard at a $150 Metro with a dead engine, and I have a nice old 1.5D that's in need of a car...

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I am a suzuki guy, I have been told that they have the same bolt pattern but have not verified that myself. I do know the Metro also came with the G13...
I would look for another G10, they got great gas mileage and would be an easier/cheaper swap

when I was going the flywheel spacer route I also had trouble sourcing long high grade 10x1 bolts....then one day I noticed my mt. bike had a similiar thread on the rear axle...(yes 10x1) ....not sure of the grade but there are many hubs out there that have very strong chromoly axles...you may try that as a stud option...also a ford 2.9 V6 found in ranger trucks has a fairly long 10x1 bolt for the flywheel but I'm not sure if it's long enough...I have some at the shop and I'll measure them this afternoon...also check these out...probably not long enough but worth a look ....http://www.ecstuning.com/Audi-B6_A4-Quattro-1.8T/Search/Free_Shipping/ES240396/

Napa auto parts can supply me 12.9 grade allen head bolts 10x1x60, which is exactly what I need. The price is actually quite reasonable too at less than $2 per bolt. The catch is I have to buy the whole box of 25 and pay $7 freight. Not that bad really. I ordered lower grade bolts for now at $1.4 each just to see how everything fits before I proceed to the stronger bolts and final assembly. If I do decide to buy the box of bolts I will obviously have extras for this very specific project so if anyone else is interested let me know.

410onefour said:

Napa auto parts can supply me 12.9 grade allen head bolts 10x1x60, which is exactly what I need.

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So I'm assuming you want to use those bolts because the head is lower than the factory triple square bolts? I was measuring the factory bolt and the head was 16mm wide and 7mm high. The width poses a problem for my adapter. What is the width and height of your NAPA bolt heads?