Hillhold sucks

paulpas

Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2008
Location
Racine County, WI
TDI
2012 Passat TDI SE 6-Speed
It grabs on for too long on a hill and I stall 50% of the time, or it causes me to slip the clutch more as I waste the engines power into slipping the clutch until it lets me go. Is there any way to disable it or shorten how long it holds on?

-Paul

2012 Passat TDI SE 6-Speed
 

dweisel

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Location
Wheeling, West Virginia
TDI
dweisel isn't diesel anymore!
It grabs on for too long on a hill and I stall 50% of the time, or it causes me to slip the clutch more as I waste the engines power into slipping the clutch until it lets me go. Is there any way to disable it or shorten how long it holds on?

-Paul

2012 Passat TDI SE 6-Speed
You can disable with VCDS.
 

under2x

Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2011
Location
Colorado USA
TDI
2012 Passat TDI SE manual
Weird, I find it to be extremely useful and haven't had any problems with it. My driveway is on a hill so i use it almost every day.
 

paulpas

Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2008
Location
Racine County, WI
TDI
2012 Passat TDI SE 6-Speed
I tend to roll back less than an inch when on a hill so I only need the assist for a fraction of a second. If I were in SFBay I might appreciate that 1 solid second that it grabs hold. It just really messes with me and makes the starts jerky once it finally lets go. I dislike it.
 

gergg

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 6, 2011
Location
Georgia
TDI
2012 Passat TDI 6M
I love the hill-hold feature......driving around my neck of the woods(hills) the wife says it makes the Passat 6M care-free to drive.
 

physicshogon

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2011
Location
Virginia
TDI
2012 Passat
It grabs on for too long on a hill and I stall 50% of the time, or it causes me to slip the clutch more as I waste the engines power into slipping the clutch until it lets me go. Is there any way to disable it or shorten how long it holds on?

-Paul

2012 Passat TDI SE 6-Speed
What exactly is the hill hold feature and how do you enable it?
 

dweisel

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Location
Wheeling, West Virginia
TDI
dweisel isn't diesel anymore!
Hill Assist holds the brake 2 seconds when you are startin out on a hiIt probably would have been enabled from the factory. IF not you can use VCDS to activate/set it.
 

no-blue-screen

TDI Nut
Joined
Feb 9, 2006
Location
Maryland
TDI
TDI
I find it useful. Coming from a 5-spd I have accidentally hit 4th (instead of 6th) more than I have stalled it (twice in 2500+ miles). Steep hill starts take some getting used to.
 

740GLE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Location
NH
TDI
2015 Passat SEL, 2017 Alltrack SE; BB 2010 Sedan Man; 2012 Passat,
I find it useful. Coming from a 5-spd I have accidentally hit 4th (instead of 6th) more than I have stalled it (twice in 2500+ miles). Steep hill starts take some getting used to.
For me it was going into third instead of first, stalled it 3 times trying to pull a u-turn 10 minutes after picking it up from the dealer, I just wasn't used to how the shifter was sprung band new.
 

JAvendan

New member
Joined
Jan 5, 2012
Location
Northern San Diego County
TDI
No TDI yet :)
Hill Assist holds the brake 2 seconds when you are startin out on a hiIt probably would have been enabled from the factory. IF not you can use VCDS to activate/set it.
Oh!

I test drove a 2012 Golf TDI 4D 6SPD and thought there was a problem w the hill holder as I was rolling back after a few seconds.

Having had a 2005 Forester w hill holder I thought there was a problem w the Golf's.

The Forester's hill holder would hold until it was time to get going.

Joel
 

geodug

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2011
Location
Vancouver, BC, Canada
TDI
2011 Golf Wagon TDI 6MT
Good news guys, I just read this topic which reminded me that I have wanted to get rid of the Hill Hold feature since taking delivery of my car 6 months ago.

Hill Hold is just too invasive for me. It is supposed to hold for 2 seconds (in spite of some folks who insist that it cancels when you hit the accelerator). Either I am too impatient or sometimes it holds longer than two seconds and I heat up my clutch instead or stall.

I have done all manner of internet searching and could not find a definitive answer until I made up my mind to solve it tonight. So, I found this page on myturbodiesel.

http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/a6/hill-hold-disable-vw.htm

It worked totally great with my VCDS. I could not find what other folks were saying, that you could change it to Long, Short or Medium hold. It was either on or off, so I shut it off and went for a drive. I could not be happier.

I started driving with manual trannies and just drove a lot of automatics in recent years so I no longer need or want this Hill Hold crutch. Hopefully it will work on your Passats.
 

slamhouse

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2011
Location
Stanwood, WA
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI SE
from what i remember, the earlier versions of hill hold would hold the car until enough forward energy was exerted to overcome the downhill force, at which point it released. as i would imagine this to carry over to the newer generation as it was actually quite nice and functioned great, they may have went with a timer system instead...
 

geodug

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2011
Location
Vancouver, BC, Canada
TDI
2011 Golf Wagon TDI 6MT
Is there a possibility that the OP and my car are malfunctioning?

It sounds like his hill holder is not releasing until the approx 2 seconds have passed. This is regardless of clutch and/or accelerator movement. Mine behaves exactly the same way causing more clutch wear than I would like.

For me, I think it will still be better to turn it off in part due to the smaller inclines where you don't know whether it is on or off.

What are the experiences of others with manual transmissions? Mine is a 2011 Golf Wagon (JSW in the US).
 

gergg

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 6, 2011
Location
Georgia
TDI
2012 Passat TDI 6M
I think there is a problem with cars of those who say the brake holds for 2 seconds no matter what you do.....I just went out and played with mine on a hill today, the hill-brake releases as soon as the "gas/diesel" pedal is depressed. If mine held for 2 seconds even after depressing throttle, that would be a problem.
 

slamhouse

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2011
Location
Stanwood, WA
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI SE
just for kicks and giggles, lets make sure you're using the system properly...

1) come to a complete stop
2) fully press clutch pedal to fullest extension
3) release brake pedal
(at this point the car should hold its-self in place
3)press accelerator to desired position
4) start releasing the clutch
(the car should now give you the 2 second buffer to begin actuating the throttle and clutch to begin forward movement)
5) hill-hold program exits and you are in control.

im guessing that the hill-hold gives a 2-second buffer once the clutch begins moving for you to start moving, and if you dont have the clutch fully depressed, it thinks that you're ready to start moving and exits after 2-seconds...

just my 2-cents...
 

geodug

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 22, 2011
Location
Vancouver, BC, Canada
TDI
2011 Golf Wagon TDI 6MT
Holy cow slamhouse, if I read your notes correctly your setup is worse than mine. The way you describe it, the 2 second interval starts when you start engaging the clutch. If that's what you meant then your clutch is heating up against the brakes longer than mine.

My take of the situation is that the 2 second interval starts the moment you take your foot off the brake. The brake continues to hold for 2 seconds no matter what you do with the other pedals. I don't like that because sometimes I mistime it and now I'm cooking the clutch needlessly until it releases.

Apparently, some other owners think that hitting the throttle or engaging the clutch cuts the 2 second interval short. I'm not sure if that is a fact or not because mine does not do that.

By the sounds of it, yours doesn't either. ????
 

gergg

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 6, 2011
Location
Georgia
TDI
2012 Passat TDI 6M
Apparently, some other owners think that hitting the throttle or engaging the clutch cuts the 2 second interval short. I'm not sure if that is a fact or not because mine does not do that.
Well, I can tell you with certainty that my hill-hold disengages with depression of the throttle...fact.
 

monstersinc1

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 7, 2011
Location
Central NJ
TDI
2012 Passat TDI SEL
Well, I can tell you with certainty that my hill-hold disengages with depression of the throttle...fact.
If hillhold works the same across all VAG products, I would agree with "gergg". I rented a Seat Allahambra in Poland over the summer (TDI w/6M) and it worked just as described. (hill-hold immediately disengaged with depression of the throttle). This car also had a start-stop TDI, something we don't have in the US.
 

no-blue-screen

TDI Nut
Joined
Feb 9, 2006
Location
Maryland
TDI
TDI
Mine releases only afterapplying throttle and letting off the clutch. perhaps this two seconds is the 'early' setting referred to in the other thread.

BTW....the start/stop is part of the blumotion tech IIRC.
 

dweisel

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Location
Wheeling, West Virginia
TDI
dweisel isn't diesel anymore!
just for kicks and giggles, lets make sure you're using the system properly...

1) come to a complete stop
2) fully press clutch pedal to fullest extension
3) release brake pedal
(at this point the car should hold its-self in place
3)press accelerator to desired position
4) start releasing the clutch
(the car should now give you the 2 second buffer to begin actuating the throttle and clutch to begin forward movement)
5) hill-hold program exits and you are in control.

im guessing that the hill-hold gives a 2-second buffer once the clutch begins moving for you to start moving, and if you dont have the clutch fully depressed, it thinks that you're ready to start moving and exits after 2-seconds...

just my 2-cents...
From how I learned to drive a clutch many,many years ago you have steps 3 and 4 in revearse order.

You are at a stop on a hill.
1) Left foot depressing the clutch. right foot holding the brake.
2) Start releasing the clutch until you feel/hear the clutch start to engage. STOP your left foot at that point. You can now move your right foot from the brake pedal to the fuel pedal. With your left foot and the clutch at this point you can hold the car on the steepest of hills.
3) Now slowly release the clutch pedal more. Your rpms will start to drop,so you slowly depress the fuel pedal more and release the clutch at the same time.At this point you should be moving forward.

Proper clutch operation is a moot point as everyone is going to do it their way. In my opinion this hill hold feature will reduce average clutch life.

Past vehicles:
87 Jeep Cherokee 2.1 Diesel 350,000 original clutch. SOLD
86 VW Golf 1.9 diesel 230,000 mi original clutch. SOLD
96 VW Passat Wagon tdi 214,000 mi original clutch. SOLD
 

MyAvocation

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jun 9, 2004
Location
Hoffman Estates, IL
TDI
2017 Passat SEL TSI
... except that CR motors aren't programmed well and stall much much easier than previous designs. It's my opinion this is why Hill Holder was added.
 

slamhouse

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2011
Location
Stanwood, WA
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI SE
ive just gotten so used to the clutch on mine that i let the clutch out until it grabs and i slowly let it out more and more likke im trying to stall it and the motor applies more torque then i let off the brake pedal and i automatically roll forward while going uphill... works for me everytime...
 

dweisel

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 28, 2006
Location
Wheeling, West Virginia
TDI
dweisel isn't diesel anymore!
... except that CR motors aren't programmed well and stall much much easier than previous designs. It's my opinion this is why Hill Holder was added.
I thought the hill hold originally was introduced on the DSG transmission to prevent roll back when the clutchs decoupled. Then on later MY's put on both DSG and manual transmissons.
 

manual_tranny

Smyth Performance- Intern
Joined
Jan 5, 2010
Location
New Bedford, MA
TDI
2001 Golf @182K; 2000 Jetta @290K
If I were in the market for a new car, I would make them disable that nonsense even before I considered taking it for a test drive.
 
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