A new diesel option-F150

kjclow

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Kind of old news but still nothing concrete on the price or capabilities of the F-150 diesel for towing. In looking at the Ram, you loose as much as 2600 pounds of towing capacity going to the diesel.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
Most people with half ton full sized pickups drive around with them empty most of the time. Besides, in many cases the tow rating is limited by the brakes and suspension anyway.

I'd say it is a good option, but it won't be cheap. I think it is the same engine that the big Range Rovers get (at least, I know they use a 3.0L Ford V6 diesel).

This is old news, though.
 

kjclow

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That's why I'm surprised at the big drop in the Ram's tow rating. One would think that the suspension and brakes are the same regardless of the engine set up. Even going to the higher ratio axle doesn't help much.
 

oilhammer

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That's why I'm surprised at the big drop in the Ram's tow rating. One would think that the suspension and brakes are the same regardless of the engine set up. Even going to the higher ratio axle doesn't help much.
So how much are we talking as compared to the standard Pentastar engine? Since that is a closer comparison that the giant Hemi V8.

This is the problem, we (the general American populace) have allowed ourselves to be brainwashed into thinking diesel = massive torque and a tow monster. Well, yeah, if it is a giant 6.7L V8 or I6. But a 3.0L V6? Not so much. It is a light duty high MPG engine choice. I think most folks who buck up for one would be happy with it.

Keep in mind, tow ratings are also granted by emissions compliance, and this engine may too easily fall out of compliance when under an extra load. This is why TDIs in the US get the "YOU CANNOT TOW ANYTHING" thrown at them, when the same engine in Europe most certainly can, and they do, just as much as a comparable gasoline engine in a comparable car.
 

RebelTDI

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If I had a snow plow, this is what I'd want. Sadly, I have now motorcycles, snowmobiles or boat to haul around.
 

kjclow

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So how much are we talking as compared to the standard Pentastar engine? Since that is a closer comparison that the giant Hemi V8.
Diesel gives you about 90 pounds more towing than the V6 gasser.
 

kjclow

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It's only a problem when the trailer your wife really likes comes in around 10,000 pounds. We are planning on touring the country so want our tenement on wheels to be as comfortable as possible.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
It's only a problem when the trailer your wife really likes comes in around 10,000 pounds. We are planning on touring the country so want our tenement on wheels to be as comfortable as possible.
You need a 3/4 ton truck. Problem solved. Although if it is a 5th wheel, a 1-ton truck with dual rear wheels makes a HUGE difference in stability. Especially the 5th wheel campers with the big tall attic thing hanging out in front.
 

kjclow

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Nope, not going to be a fifth wheel. Still want to use the bed of the truck for hauling the bikes and anything else that we may want quicker access to.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
So a 3/4 ton truck will do ya fine. And with that much weight hanging off the rear, the longer the wheelbase the better it will handle. Not sure if it will *need* the load leveler stabilizer rods on the hitch, but it certainly wouldn't hurt. Plus, the dry weight of a camper is just a starting point. The bigger they are, the more cabinets, cupboards, closets, beds, tanks, etc. they have to put stuff in... and it all adds up.
 

kjclow

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Yup, I'm looking at recommended fully loaded weight. Hate to get into the mountains and feel like Ricky Ricardo!
 

whitedog

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Keep in mind, tow ratings are also granted by emissions compliance, and this engine may too easily fall out of compliance when under an extra load. This is why TDIs in the US get the "YOU CANNOT TOW ANYTHING" thrown at them, when the same engine in Europe most certainly can, and they do, just as much as a comparable gasoline engine in a comparable car.
Oh... That makes sense.

As to price, I thought I read that the Fords were $40,000 trucks with the good engine.

Now I was going g to ask if this engine has been proven in other markets, but then I remembered the PD engine had been out in Europe but when it came over here, they changed things enough that there were some small problems like glow plugs and tandem pumps .
 

oilhammer

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Well the thing to remember when we say "PD" is that Europe also had a 16-valve PD engine, which is very different than the 8-valve versions.

I think Siemens supplied the injection system on those 16v PDs, and they had a lot of problems.

But again, the Euro vs. North America spec can make a lot of things different too. And I repeatedly have to remind folks here about that, as so often someone from Europe wants to apply knowledge of their version of an engine to ours, and in many cases it simply doesn't apply. Europe did not even get full OBD-2 compliance until around 2003. They had "EOBD", and a lot of VAG training literature even for us still refers to that, as well as a lot of our models still have the DLC mounting hole in the center console for the EOBD cars.
 

whitedog

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This is the problem, we (the general American populace) have allowed ourselves to be brainwashed into thinking diesel = massive torque and a tow monster. Well, yeah, if it is a giant 6.7L V8 or I6. But a 3.0L V6? Not so much. It is a light duty high MPG engine choice.
I forgot to comment on this part...

So does this mean a 4 cly TDI would be a bad choice in a Dodge truck even with a 13 speed transmission as someone here was thinking.:rolleyes:
 

mech644

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That’s the stuff Whitedog!
Im going one better and swap a 3cyl Tdi into an F450 dually with an 18spd! It’s a wonder VW and Ford haven’t partnered up and made this thing already!

Price on the 1/2 ton diesel Ford will be at least 45k, its only available with the two top level trim lines, Platinum and Limited I think.
Fleet buyers can get it in lesser trim lines but not the average citizen.
 

Oberkanone

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Lariat +

That’s the stuff Whitedog!
Im going one better and swap a 3cyl Tdi into an F450 dually with an 18spd! It’s a wonder VW and Ford haven’t partnered up and made this thing already!

Price on the 1/2 ton diesel Ford will be at least 45k, its only available with the two top level trim lines, Platinum and Limited I think.
Fleet buyers can get it in lesser trim lines but not the average citizen.
Lariat and higher. Lariat is trim level above XLT.
 

Capt. Common Rail

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Priced f150 diesel at dealer

Priced out a lariat and not even very loaded no navigation not to many options
Msrp came out over$54,000. Dealer discounts with rebates was about $4000.
$50,000 is a lot of money to pay for a truck you can't even test drive. Think I'll
wait for the Gmc 3.0 liter diesel to come out and do a comparison.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
My dad's 2.7L 2015 F150 was $46k. XLT trim, 4WD, Supercab (not a crew cab) short (but not teeny) bed. Has a couple of options, but minor ones, not much over what came standard with the XLT package.

The same truck today for 2018 would be about $48.5k. So your configured diesel price is not too different, assuming it is probably more tarted up than my dad's truck is (and you said Lariat, so I already know it is).

Cab configuration makes a difference too, where applicable. I suspect the Silverado will be similarly priced. The Ram you could actually configure a "real" working man's truck with the diesel engine, low Tradesman trim, with a regular cab, and a real 8 foot bed, but these would be very rare and special order for sure. And those could be had for low $30k range. Ford's decision to only offer the diesel with the two highest trim levels automatically pushes the price higher. Hard for me to justify spending $50k on a truck either, diesle or not, when you could literally buy TWO F150s brand new for that.

All depends on what you want though. The fancier ones tank so fast in value it would make sense to buy a slightly used one, let someone else take the giant money fire initial depreciation hit. But the diesel powered ones will almost certainly hold their value much, much better.
 
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kjclow

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When I priced the Ford at the Lariat trim level and then add in an estimated $6000 for the diesel, it pushes the price over $60. Even with my x-plan, I'll still be right around $60. Puts it about $6000 higher than a similar equipped Ram. I agree with the captain, I'll wait and see where GM pricing falls.
 

turbobrick240

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I miss the days when a truck was just a truck, not a red neck status symbol that required refinancing ones home to be affordable. It is good to see the 1/2 ton diesel options though. Maybe GM will offer the 3.0 throughout the trim level range.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
I miss the days when a truck was just a truck, not a red neck status symbol that required refinancing ones home to be affordable. It is good to see the 1/2 ton diesel options though. Maybe GM will offer the 3.0 throughout the trim level range.

Agreed. This is why I like my simple, sturdy, 1996 F150.... 6 cylinders, making a whopping 150hp and 250tq, never needing to spin past about 3500 RPM, three pedals, 8 foot bed, and a bench seat.



Of course, I am contractually obligated to have at least one pickup to live in Franklin Co. MO, and you get bonus points if it is American. No gun rack, though. :p
 

turbobrick240

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Agreed. This is why I like my simple, sturdy, 1996 F150.... 6 cylinders, making a whopping 150hp and 250tq, never needing to spin past about 3500 RPM, three pedals, 8 foot bed, and a bench seat.

Of course, I am contractually obligated to have at least one pickup to live in Franklin Co. MO, and you get bonus points if it is American. No gun rack, though. :p

Right on, now that's a mans truck. Before Americans got soft and came to expect heated leather vibrating seats, apple whateverplay, and all the other b.s. that has no place in a true work truck.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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I happened to stop by our local Ford dealer today to get some info on the new Diesel F150. Took some photos of trucks on the lot, including this price sticker.


And I don't think it was the most expensive F150 there. Funny, since I was sent a price sticker for a leftover '16 Audi A6 TDI yesterday, and sticker was $66K. I'm not buying either, but I know which I'd rather spend that much money on.
 

mech644

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The redneck characterization is silly.
F150 is the #1 selling vehicle to buyers with incomes over 200k.
Trucks sell, and with options they sell even more, add luxury type options and they sell even better. The big three have made many mistakes but flooding dealer lots with +50k trucks is not one of them.
If the majority of the market WANTS loaded up trucks then that’s what big three should sell them. They limit production of lower trim levels because the profit margin is vastly lower.
 
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