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Fuels & Lubricants Discussion all about Fuels & Lubricants. synthetic oil, conventional oil, brands, change intervals, diesel grades, gelling and such debated items like that. Non TDI related postings will be moved or removed. This forum is NOT for the discussion of biodiesel and other alternative fuels.

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Old June 14th, 2015, 01:25   #8281
Tom Servo
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The two men quickly apologized and went outside to move their trucks. I thanked them and apologized for bothering them.
Canada - the world's politest nation.
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Old June 14th, 2015, 18:23   #8282
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Canada - the world's politest nation.
Thanks!
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Old June 15th, 2015, 14:03   #8283
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the reason gas stations price the way they do is that 1mill difference between what the actual cost and what you actually pay is pure profit!
Gas stations do round up and round down -- for example, if your total comes out to $20.284, you pay $20.28, and if the total comes out to $20.285, you pay $20.29.

Fractional pricing dates back to the Great Depression, when gasoline was selling for as low as 10 cents per gallon, and 1 cent increments weren't enough to adjust for differing fuel prices and fuel tax rates.

Fuel prices used to end in various fractional amounts -- such as .2 or .6 cents -- until the 1970s when .9 became standard.
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Old June 15th, 2015, 17:20   #8284
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Got my first story today.

Waited a few minutes in line for my fill up at the local store affiliated station. I pull up third in line and wait my turn, until finally I'm the next one in line, ready to pull to the pump, and a service guy puts out a cone and starts taking a panel off the pump I have to use. He then lifts the green diesel nozzle and empties the contents into some sort of special container. Since not every pump has diesel, I grumble at not getting warned and pull around to the go to the back of the line at the other island.

About three minutes later the service worker comes around (having seen me turn around and exit) and tells me "you should have waited - you'd be first in line". Turns out he was changing the filter in the pump. I found out why as I'm waiting in the second line for even longer while the Porsche Cayenne at the pump in front of me takes way, way too long to fill. The guy tells me the flow rate on the diesel pumps was down to about 3 gallons a minute. After hearing that, I figure it's better to let him do this pump before I start my fill (after I decide whether or not I want a tank full of whatever is fouling the filters).

So he finally finishes while the lady behind me is trying to figure out why I don't just pull into the open island in front of me which I'm blocking (no choice) that doesn't have a diesel pump. The whole thing took probably 20 minutes from the time I pull in until I drive out. All of this could have been avoided if I hadn't tried to fuel at a station on Friday that had a gasoline size nozzle on their diesel pump that wouldn't engage the safety flap.

Bad week for fillups for me.
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Old June 15th, 2015, 17:47   #8285
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Today I went to fill up at $2.61 (RUG at $2.57) at a BP that has a diesel-only pair of islands.

At the other island there's a US truck fueling up, sees me with the glove and nods and smiles at me.

Then a gasser stops at the other side (an Oldsmobile sedan with a young driver on the phone). I want to tell him, "son, this is a deesel-only island" but he doesn't even acknowledges me.

So I finish up, start recording my fuel data and he finally gets out of the car, looks at the island (1 handle! Big DIESEL ONLY sign!), he looks at me all confused and leaves.

Oh well.


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Old June 15th, 2015, 19:59   #8286
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hi all. good to see/read the new stories. 1.2m+ views/posts. bizuuump!
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Old June 15th, 2015, 21:07   #8287
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Originally Posted by vwestlife View Post
Gas stations do round up and round down -- for example, if your total comes out to $20.284, you pay $20.28, and if the total comes out to $20.285, you pay $20.29.

Fractional pricing dates back to the Great Depression, when gasoline was selling for as low as 10 cents per gallon, and 1 cent increments weren't enough to adjust for differing fuel prices and fuel tax rates.

Fuel prices used to end in various fractional amounts -- such as .2 or .6 cents -- until the 1970s when .9 became standard.
Unfortunately, the rounding in your second example is not following the rules: if it ends in 1 through 4, you round down; if it ends in 6 through 9 you round up; if it ends in 5, you round to the even number. So your $20.285 should be rounded down to $20.28, while a total of $20.275 should be rounded up to $20.28. That way it is balanced; unfortunately merchants tend to go for what gives them more money so we have the improper rounding of 5 to the next highest full number even when it is an odd number.
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Old June 16th, 2015, 00:26   #8288
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I pulled in to a truck stop 2 days ago and filled my car with the great big high pressure nozzle. Took about 15 seconds for 11 gallons. I love having an old diesel that's easy to put fuel in!
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Old June 16th, 2015, 06:54   #8289
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Unfortunately, the rounding in your second example is not following the rules: if it ends in 1 through 4, you round down; if it ends in 6 through 9 you round up; if it ends in 5, you round to the even number. So your $20.285 should be rounded down to $20.28, while a total of $20.275 should be rounded up to $20.28. That way it is balanced; unfortunately merchants tend to go for what gives them more money so we have the improper rounding of 5 to the next highest full number even when it is an odd number.
Is that New Math? I was never taught the odd/even rounding on the 5's thing in school; we were taught that 5 always rounds up. Thus my fictitious example was based on my understanding, not on actual data I've recorded.

I tried looking it up, but unfortunately the latest information I can find online is from 1979 (!) when the National Conference on Weights and Measures, who sets the standards for gas pumps, was considering requiring odd/even rounding, but had not mandated it yet.
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Last edited by vwestlife; June 16th, 2015 at 06:59.
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Old June 16th, 2015, 07:12   #8290
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oK heres my story...

Locally, we have a station called Rotten Robbie. I dont know why its called that, it just is.

Well I finish up pumping my TDi and I have been chatting with this guy about his car. He finishes up topping off his tank and he turns to me and without realizing what he is doing, he points the fuel nozzle ( gasoline ) and squeezes the trigger and unleashes a torrent of fuel that hit me mid chest and soaked my entire body in fuel. I was simply at a loss for words... It was also hot as hell out as it was in the middle of summer. I moved away from everyone and had someone call my friend to come and get me in his truck where rode in the bed to my house to change.
Trust me Johnny Flame from the Fantastic Four was very much on my mind..
He wasn't a male model, was he?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnZ2XdqGZWU

- skip to 1:40 to get to the relevant part :-)
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Old June 16th, 2015, 07:52   #8291
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Is that New Math? I was never taught the odd/even rounding on the 5's thing in school; we were taught that 5 always rounds up. Thus my fictitious example was based on my understanding, not on actual data I've recorded.
As a scientist, these were my exact thoughts. 1-4 round down, all else round up. Same way my wife teaches grade school math.
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Old June 16th, 2015, 08:03   #8292
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Originally Posted by vwestlife View Post
Is that New Math? I was never taught the odd/even rounding on the 5's thing in school; we were taught that 5 always rounds up. Thus my fictitious example was based on my understanding, not on actual data I've recorded.

I tried looking it up, but unfortunately the latest information I can find online is from 1979 (!) when the National Conference on Weights and Measures, who sets the standards for gas pumps, was considering requiring odd/even rounding, but had not mandated it yet.
No, that is what I was taught in elementary, junior high, and senior high school. The only math class I took in college was a trig course. It maybe "old" school as with the advent of things like the "New Math" some 40 years ago, the majority of of high school graduates seem to be functionally math illiterate. I was also taught that if there are several digits after a decimal point to start rounding at the last digit and continue until you get to the require final digit position. Or the "always round 5 up" may be from the IRS requirement to round $0.50 up to the next dollar.

Whatever the reason, I've been rounding this way for the last 50 - 60 years. BTW, when someone asks me what is a fuel price, I usually round it to the nearest full cent.
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Old June 16th, 2015, 09:24   #8293
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I was also taught that if there are several digits after a decimal point to start rounding at the last digit and continue until you get to the require final digit position.

Never, ever heard it that way.
x.49999.... is still less the 4.5 - so x.49999.... get rounded down
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Old June 16th, 2015, 09:37   #8294
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Never, ever heard it that way.
x.49999.... is still less the 4.5 - so x.49999.... get rounded down
Try telling a fuel station that!
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Old June 16th, 2015, 09:38   #8295
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It's called banker's rounding or gaussian rounding, compared to standard rounding. It is used to unbias rounding results which otherwise have more than half of the values rounding up instead of a roughly equal proportion up and down.
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