2004 Jetta BEW PD EGR Pipe Cracked in Flex Joint, 3rd time

2004 Jetta BEW PD EGR Pipe Cracked in Flex Joint, 3rd time.

Purchased the car with 116k miles, the car started whistling at about 122K. Found the EGR Pipe cracked at the flex joint. Had dealer install a new pipe, 1200 miles later the pipe cracked and whistled again. Another new pipe was installed and less than 500 miles I see the flex pipe is cracked again, one joint is loaded with black. The two new pipes appear to have the flex area moved from the first one that was on the car when we purchased it.

Any ideas?

Thanks,

Fasteddie10

Possibly missing the egr cooler bracket? Maybe the dealer left it off when they did the recall, this will cause it to crack.

http://idparts.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=2201

The dealer is not installing the cooler bracket. This happened to me, and after 6-7 flex pipes the dealer finally listened to me.

There's also a specific bolt tightening and installation pattern that MUST be followed, or the life of the flex pipe will be compromised.

My experience is that you'll need to replace the pipe every 30-50K miles, even when installed correctly, but YMMV.

EGR Cooler Bracket IS Missing!

Thanks, I did find the EGR cooler bracket is missing. The car is going in tomorrow for replacing the EGR tube again. I will let them know about the missing bracket.

Thanks Again,

Fasteddie10

also having repeat EGR pipe failure

I have been having a similar problem.
(note: EGR cooler recall done in 2007, some 30k miles ago),
0) I had a lower pipe break in April.
1) I have had lower pipe re-break. Noticed the exhaust gas smell immediately after getting the car back from the repair, but the real nature of the break became apapraent maybe 3k later. They repalced the lower pipe but told me that the EGR cooler was also shot and that was also replaced about a week later when they got the part in
2) within 200 miles, noticed an exhaust smell traced to EGR cooler leak (presumabaly a gasket failure). They replaced the lower pipe again and the gasket for the cooler.
3) followed by an upper pipe breakage
4) followed by another upper pipe break (this one broke at one of the flanges, where the pipe is welded to the flange. The replacement pipe had a much beefier weld at the flange, so apparently there's differences in lots, or differences in production years)
5) followed by a lower pipe break (last week; unknown to me whether it was in the flex-section or elsewhere)

Volkswagen America is involved since they're paying for the work at this point. They told the dealership to replace "all" the mouting brackets. I can't find the mounting bracket(s) on my eBahn program to know whether its bracket or bracket"s". Anyway, they're seemingly stumped but hopefully this will work (though I haven't removed from the car my section of garden hose that I use to stethoscope the leaks).

If the dealers actually followed the TSB and used all the fasteners, none of this would be happening. Its hard to get back there so their techs don't want to bother putting in all the fasteners which results in pipe breakage.

There are also a subset of us whose brackets are installed correctly yet still break pipes. Hopefully you are not one of those (like I was).

the way to solve the problem is to eliminate the need for the pipes all together

Fasteddie10 said:

Thanks, I did find the EGR cooler bracket is missing. The car is going in tomorrow for replacing the EGR tube again. I will let them know about the missing bracket.

Thanks Again,

Fasteddie10

Click to expand...

You think the dealers would know about this issue by now through an internal memo or something. I guess they just don't care. This has been going on for about 4 years. Poor, very poor of Volkswagen.

--Nate

The dealer parts list does NOT show the bracket for my car. Today they found the mount for the egr cooler broken. I found the M6 EGR cooler recall, in this document, item 12 is the bracket. The M6 includes my car, they are ordering the bracket and installing the new cooler, 3rd lower egr tube, and bracket for about $235.

Fifth Time was a Charm

We had five break at an average of interval of 1,800 miles, on the third I said to the dealer something must be fundamentally wrong, there's got to be a reason for this, is something else misaligned. Nope, just a bad design...

Fifth replacement was here in Germany where probably 70%, if not more, of the Golfs/Boras/Jettas are TDIs. They immediately said the pipe was installed backwards! The hamfisted folks back in Hawaii obviously didn't read instructions and forced the pipe on each time mimicking what the first guy did.

Service here is expensive (Heck, a liter of motor oil is $29.00!) but it's done properly.

Just remove the EGR cooler, block off the EGR, chiptune the ECU to rid the CEL and never look back!

--Nate

And loose MPG and take longer to warm up as well. The PD cars seem to take some pretty good MPG hits with the EGR removed due to the longer warm up times.

I welded up a broken mounting tab on my EGR cooler, replaced all the brackets that the dealer left in the trash bin, and reassembled exactly per the TSB. I believe everything has to be lined up and loosely bolted before anything gets tighten down, if I recall correctly. Two years later, no repeat failures yet.
I kept the cooler b/c I need all the warm-up aids I can get.

Does anyone know where to get the egr bracket?? I'm going on my 3rd pipe & didn't have a bracket when I changed it the first time. B

Order it from the VW dealer. Its not expensive.

--Nate

what are the symptoms of a broken egr pipe?

I had the exact same issue. It was the bolts in the EGR valve. They had vibrated out and were causing the pipe to bare the weight. Found bolts. no more issue.

SMUG SLUG said:

what are the symptoms of a broken egr pipe?

Click to expand...

I've never had the upper pipe break. In my experience, some or all of the following occur for the lower pipe:

High pitched whistle/ring at certain rpm (1800-2100?) during the early stages when the pipe first cracks, leading to exhaust fume smell with louder noise, finally to lots of exhaust smell and exhaust noise with car going into limp mode (runs poorly) when the pipe completely breaks. I've never gotten a CEL because of a pipe break though.

On my PD engine, the broken bracket was literally part of the EGR cooler, and came with the replacement cooler for ~$50-$60. after I removed my EGR cooler it was quite evident the lower tab was broken off the cooler. I have large thin hands, I can only imagine the fun most muscular handed mechanics would have trying to get that back together properly.

IDParts or one of the websites I was researching parts on clearly warned that most owners with broken EGR pipes will also find a broken EGR cooler mounting tab if they check. Mechanics who don't check don't do themselves any favors when they do the work two and three times. I did mine once, more than four months ago, but I'm not a mechanic.

Tom_B said:

I've never had the upper pipe break. In my experience, some or all of the following occur for the lower pipe:

High pitched whistle/ring at certain rpm (1800-2100?) during the early stages when the pipe first cracks, leading to exhaust fume smell with louder noise, finally to lots of exhaust smell and exhaust noise with car going into limp mode (runs poorly) when the pipe completely breaks. I've never gotten a CEL because of a pipe break though.

Click to expand...

thanks - I am having different symptoms.....

Remove the EGR/Cooler and never have the problem again.

I got my new lower pipe installed (3rd one) but wondering how to get the lower bolt on the cooler bracket. I got a new cooler bracket as mine was missing. Aparently the prior owner had the recall done by at the stealership who again didn't put the bracket on. Any tips on the bottom bolt install? Tks B

Someone must have some experience with this bracket? Any tips on getting the bottom bolt in?? Thanks B

I guess I need to put the bottom bolt in first (if possible)on the EGR support bracket if not then I will remove the coolerB

I am on my 3rd pipe installation. I am looking for some feedback on a few ideas I have for avoiding future pipe breaks. (i'll be the first to admit, i took short cuts on previous attempts but have really learned my lession after breaking a pipe in less than a month.) I will be following the M6 instructions implicitly, but incase these are not enough:

1. What about a reinforcement weld on the flex pipe (both sides of the accordian flex piece) or using a muffler tape like wrap for additional support?
2. Using loctite on the mounting screws for the EGR cooler.. will this lead to any other malfuction as in leading to a bigger problem?

any thoughts???

2004GolfTDI said:

I am on my 3rd pipe installation. I am looking for some feedback on a few ideas I have for avoiding future pipe breaks. (i'll be the first to admit, i took short cuts on previous attempts but have really learned my lession after breaking a pipe in less than a month.) I will be following the M6 instructions implicitly, but incase these are not enough:

1. What about a reinforcement weld on the flex pipe (both sides of the accordian flex piece) or using a muffler tape like wrap for additional support?
2. Using loctite on the mounting screws for the EGR cooler.. will this lead to any other malfuction as in leading to a bigger problem?

any thoughts???

Click to expand...

My experience has been once *all* the parts were installed, are in good working order (no broken tabs, etc), and the tightening sequence in the TSB was exactly followed, the breakage has stopped. The only way you'll know the sequence was followed exactly is if you loosen everything up and do it yourself. After having 3 lower pipes break after the recall was first performed, I've now gone about 75k miles without another issue. I check all the fasteners every 20k to make sure they're still tight. So far, so good.

thanks for the advise Tom B. sounds like this is one that will never be truly "fixed".

Does anyone have a copy of the TSB for the tightening sequence? I'm having the same issue with mine breaking.

I do not have a copy but it is a pia to bolt up the top bracket without taking your intake manifold off. If mine breaks again I'm going to delete it. B