post fix DSG update failure - bricked cars with no solution from VW

mpriolo

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 29, 2007
Location
New Hampshire
TDI
2009 Jetta Sedan, DSG, CP3 HPFP
I did my loyalty rewards at AutoServe, not a bad dealership, I should have looked there vs buying at Quirk for the Alltrack and the '15 Passat, next time.
I agree. I only get warranty work performed there and have had no complaints. I have been using a local mechanic in Concord for many years for my tdi repairs. They had no issues installing the CP3 HPFP last summer.

Have you been using AutoServe for maintenance/repairs?
 

VeeDubTDI

Wanderluster, Traveler, TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 2, 2000
Location
Springfield, VA
TDI
‘18 Tesla Model 3D+, ‘14 Cadillac ELR, ‘13 Fiat 500e
I don't understand why they don't just let you all switch to buyback. It's absurd to keep customers trapped limbo like this and does nothing but generate more bad PR.
 

740GLE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Location
NH
TDI
2015 Passat SEL, 2017 Alltrack SE; BB 2010 Sedan Man; 2012 Passat,
I agree. I only get warranty work performed there and have had no complaints. I have been using a local mechanic in Concord for many years for my tdi repairs. They had no issues installing the CP3 HPFP last summer.
Have you been using AutoServe for maintenance/repairs?

nope, Do you use Northern European or German Auto works in Concord?
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
Has anyone attempted to drive these cars that are supposedly bricked?

I think the point is that in a partly fixed state, they are not legal. The service rep repeated that they are not allowed to drive the car, and have to push it in and out of the service bay.

I did stop by today to give it a try.

first, noted that the battery was at 11.5 volts, and tires at 25 psi. (left rear anyway.)

I used a jump box to start the car, and verified that indeed, it would go into gear and move forwards and back.

ran the car, for a half hour to charge the battery some, and took some time to lube the door and hood latches and hinges. made sure the hvac direction controls still operate. (some were sticking a bit at first from sitting)



hooked up the VCDS and saw that the measured soot is 0, but the calculated soot is close to 15 grams.
and the oil ash reads around 129.

so at this point, they have not operated the ECU functions to reset for a new DPF.


I noted a missing screw in the bottom engine cover. ( I snapped two of them at last oil change, from the loctite that comes on replacement screws bonding to the AL subframe, but the middle one was there doing its job.)

Service rep said they would replace the screws (as good as they were when the car was dropped off), offering they may have stopped and parked the car mid-fix.

He also said he would comp a new VA inspection, since it has been there so long the inspection expired.


Also heard back from the lawyer. She said that VW said it could be another week or perhaps more.
 

Meg8

Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2017
Location
San Diego
TDI
2009 Jetta Sportwagen TDI
I think the point is that in a partly fixed state, they are not legal. The service rep repeated that they are not allowed to drive the car, and have to push it in and out of the service bay.

I did stop by today to give it a try.

first, noted that the battery was at 11.5 volts, and tires at 25 psi. (left rear anyway.)

I used a jump box to start the car, and verified that indeed, it would go into gear and move forwards and back.

ran the car, for a half hour to charge the battery some, and took some time to lube the door and hood latches and hinges. made sure the hvac direction controls still operate. (some were sticking a bit at first from sitting)



hooked up the VCDS and saw that the measured soot is 0, but the calculated soot is close to 15 grams.
and the oil ash reads around 129.

so at this point, they have not operated the ECU functions to reset for a new DPF.


I noted a missing screw in the bottom engine cover. ( I snapped two of them at last oil change, from the loctite that comes on replacement screws bonding to the AL subframe, but the middle one was there doing its job.)

Service rep said they would replace the screws (as good as they were when the car was dropped off), offering they may have stopped and parked the car mid-fix.

He also said he would comp a new VA inspection, since it has been there so long the inspection expired.


Also heard back from the lawyer. She said that VW said it could be another week or perhaps more.
Hopefully it's sooner! It's interesting that the lawyers actually know (or are willing to share) a little more about a timeline at this point. Though I still want to know how long the software solution process actually took versus internal prioritization/epa bureaucracy!
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
I gave up and purchased a 17 GSW 4motion this morning.

running out of time to get stuff put away and pack for that ski trip.

not confident driving from here to winter in VT in a car that has sat for three months, and I have not been driving.

I will miss the '09
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
The last few e-mails I got from the plaintiff staff lawyer made it sure look so.

Last was end of the day Friday. Hopefully I get more solid news by Thanksgiving.
 

Dr Chill

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2016
Location
South Florida
TDI
2016 A8L TDI
I gave up and purchased a 17 GSW 4motion this morning.

running out of time to get stuff put away and pack for that ski trip.

not confident driving from here to winter in VT in a car that has sat for three months, and I have not been driving.

I will miss the '09
I would have taken the loaner to VT and let VW come after you to get it, rather than buy another VW from them after being put through this whole ordeal. I hope they gave you a killer deal on the 17.
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
there are two parts to this, I had my roof top tent installed when I dropped it off.



it needed to come off and be put away.



I picked it up today, parked it next to it in the lot and slid it across on a couple 2x4s. Also pulled the Polar FIS PF03 from the TDI.



on driving the loaner to VT, the service advisor and dealer would have been fine with it, even if they fixed the car the day I left.

the real killer was how they treated the Jetta. a few minor scrapes and such, and when I came by to visit, the battery was a tad over 11.5 volts, and tires all at 25 psi.

I should have just sprang the car and drove it home to stow the tent after the first month.

When I hooked up the VCDS last week, the Engine controller info was same as pre-fix. I would think there would have been a difference in the shop code or version or something. perhaps the DSG software failed, and they stopped the update process before really changing the engine software.

the deal on the 2017 was not too bad. end of year on an S with 4 motion. MSRP was $26 070 and I walked out for $2091, including 4% VA tax and bs dealer paperwork fee. I did have to finance to get $1000 of the discount, but paying it off asap will keep interest costs under $100.
 
Last edited:

nozel

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 28, 2010
Location
Vancouver Canada
TDI
2006 Jetta Gas, replaced by 2009 Sportwagen, replaced by 2013 Golf Sportwagen TDI
your new 4mo TSI s

You won't be disappointed, The 4mo I bought to replace my bought back '13 TDI 'Wagen has been a pleasant surprise. Mine is a Trendline with DSG and has every thing I need, handles much better due to better weight distribution. I do miss logging for after treatment events...
 

kjclow

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 26, 2003
Location
Charlotte, NC
TDI
2010 JSW TDI silver and black. 2017 Ram Ecodiesel dark red with brown and beige interior.
I gave up and purchased a 17 GSW 4motion this morning.

running out of time to get stuff put away and pack for that ski trip.

not confident driving from here to winter in VT in a car that has sat for three months, and I have not been driving.

I will miss the '09
It's too bad you were forces into this. Looks like you got a nice set up though.
 

740GLE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Location
NH
TDI
2015 Passat SEL, 2017 Alltrack SE; BB 2010 Sedan Man; 2012 Passat,
I noted a missing screw in the bottom engine cover. ( I snapped two of them at last oil change, from the loctite that comes on replacement screws bonding to the AL subframe, but the middle one was there doing its job.)

Side note, I've never reapplied locktite on the rear larger belly pan bolts, as a matter of fact I've always used antiseize on them as they seemed to be the worse for corrosion. No idea why replacement bolts come with the blue tread tape on them.
 

740GLE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Location
NH
TDI
2015 Passat SEL, 2017 Alltrack SE; BB 2010 Sedan Man; 2012 Passat,
I gave up and purchased a 17 GSW 4motion this morning.

running out of time to get stuff put away and pack for that ski trip.

not confident driving from here to winter in VT in a car that has sat for three months, and I have not been driving.

I will miss the '09
All I can say is you will miss the MPG, the DSG drinks fuel at 70+ with crazy low gearing 60MPH is just under 2100 RPM. 6MT is slightly better

If you can keep your speeds under 65 you should be able to do 30-34MPG, at 75 I was just able to get 30.

Enjoy your baby Golf R variant.
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
Side note, I've never reapplied locktite on the rear larger belly pan bolts, as a matter of fact I've always used antiseize on them as they seemed to be the worse for corrosion. No idea why replacement bolts come with the blue tread tape on them.
Probably because they fall out. the plastic relaxes and the bolt hits the road.

I did not replace the locktite, and think it was just one replacement bolt that contaminated the outside holes with the stuff.

would have been on the schedule to drill out and replace the screws.
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
All I can say is you will miss the MPG, the DSG drinks fuel at 70+ with crazy low gearing 60MPH is just under 2100 RPM. 6MT is slightly better

If you can keep your speeds under 65 you should be able to do 30-34MPG, at 75 I was just able to get 30.

Enjoy your baby Golf R variant.
I will miss the mpg, but the $/mile should not be all that much higher.

It will be nice to have heat right away when it is chilly.

Just will have to learn to find a gas pump when the car is thirsty. (and my wife already asked if I would stop correcting her when she said gas instead of fuel.)

but we also have a sprinter motor home, so diesel is still on the menu.
 
Last edited:

bhtooefr

TDIClub Enthusiast, ToofTek Inventor
Joined
Oct 16, 2005
Location
Newark, OH
TDI
None
I still say fuel even though I only own gassers (well, OK, there's.a diesel twin in my storage unit, but it's just an engine, nothing else).

I'm wondering if I should start saying energy...
 

740GLE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Location
NH
TDI
2015 Passat SEL, 2017 Alltrack SE; BB 2010 Sedan Man; 2012 Passat,
I will miss the mpg, but the $/mile should not be all that much higher.

It will be nice to have heat right away when it is chilly.

Just will have to learn to find a gas pump when the car is thirsty. (and my wife already asked if I would stop correcting her when she said gas instead of fuel.)

but we also have a sprinter motor home, so diesel is still on the menu.
350-400 miles per tank also takes the fun out of road trips, I find myself filling up at >1/4 tank just because I'm in between either my typical fueling places and can't make the round trip.

Still glad it drinks 87, one good thing VW did in designing the gen3 that's used in all their platforms.
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
the extra fuel stops will take some getting used to.

since we are pretty well drifted into 1.8 tsi discusson, having walked away from the TDI,

I found a SSP for the 1.8 gen 3 and found a couple things.

coolant loop to the turbo, run by electric pump. and this pump runs after you shut the car off..

just like a TDI, it cuts fuel to zero when coasting.

the coolant system is capable of regulating to two coolant temperatures, and switches based on loading, (hot to warm up, cooler for highway and higher loads)
Another VW enginering complicated wonder....


Will also have trouble moving from TDI club, nice folks and a good pop-up and advertisement free place to ask for and offer help on car stuff.

Perhaps there is room here for an ex-TDI owner TSI discussion area.
 
Last edited:

bhtooefr

TDIClub Enthusiast, ToofTek Inventor
Joined
Oct 16, 2005
Location
Newark, OH
TDI
None
There's always General VW Discussion, plenty of people here know about gasser VWs.
 

740GLE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Location
NH
TDI
2015 Passat SEL, 2017 Alltrack SE; BB 2010 Sedan Man; 2012 Passat,
That and the MK7 TDI will be around for another 10+ years, and you got 90% of the car.
 

740GLE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Location
NH
TDI
2015 Passat SEL, 2017 Alltrack SE; BB 2010 Sedan Man; 2012 Passat,
Probably because they fall out. the plastic relaxes and the bolt hits the road.
In a combined 200k never had that experience, they were always snug and tight at the 10k oil drop. Maybe the extra salt, brine and magnesium chloride they use up here helped them stay put.
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
In a combined 200k never had that experience, they were always snug and tight at the 10k oil drop. Maybe the extra salt, brine and magnesium chloride they use up here helped them stay put.
and perhaps I just did not snug it in tight enough.
 

nozel

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 28, 2010
Location
Vancouver Canada
TDI
2006 Jetta Gas, replaced by 2009 Sportwagen, replaced by 2013 Golf Sportwagen TDI
Meerschm ssp ea888

"the coolant system is capable of regulating to two coolant temperatures, and switches based on loading, (hot to warm up, cooler for highway and higher loads)
Another VW enginering complicated wonder...."

The gen3 tdi cooling system has 3 loops, all computer regulated.

In the TSI installation, Computer regulates the cooling control module in EA888 (there is no thermostat) except in a failure mode, when a wax pellet valve opens to keep one moving to repair shop
I was happier to take on the EA888 with my 4motion Wagen because I figured the tdi cooling system could be problematic moving forward.

I would venture that VW is not alone implementing this technology, but I am not curious enough to go looking.
 

LibertysChild

Member
Joined
Nov 28, 2014
Location
Powhatan Va.
TDI
2006 / 2011 Jetta
Why did you have it "fixed"?

I long ago learned that you can't trust government, corporations and "liberals". This debacle is the best of all three. I just sent the ECM out for a tune and replaced the exhaust system with a good old 1960s style system removed that boost modulation valve and replaced the turbo. It works great, and it gets even better mileage when I drive it. On a recent trip to visit friends about an hour away the dash showed a 51.2 mpg average. If you are forced to get into it it moves. As a matter of fact when the wife drives it she complains about it always spinning the tires at stop lights. Yes I've tried to teach her that you don't always have to mash the accelerator to the floor, and that steady pressure vs her digital off on style on the pedal stops that jerking going down the road... at least she's cute.
 
Last edited:

740GLE

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 19, 2009
Location
NH
TDI
2015 Passat SEL, 2017 Alltrack SE; BB 2010 Sedan Man; 2012 Passat,
I long ago learned that you can't trust government, corporations and "liberals". This debacle is the best of all three. I just sent the ECM out for a tune and replaced the exhaust system with a good old 1960s style system removed that boost modulation valve and replaced the turbo. It works great, and it gets even better mileage when I drive it. On a recent trip to visit friends about an hour away the dash showed a 51.2 mpg average. If you are forced to get into it it moves. As a matter of fact when the wife drives it she complains about it always spinning the tires at stop lights. Yes I've tried to teach her that you don't always have to mash the accelerator to the floor, and that steady pressure vs her digital off on style on the pedal stops that jerking going down the road... at least she's cute.

Everyone's buyback vs fix story is different, many people weighed the option. IMO anyone that has a low mile TDI is flat out mental not to take the buyback, there is no financial sense in keeping it.

If you put on 30+k year then yeah hold on to it.
 

meerschm

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
Updated the first post. LC seems like a swell guy.
 
Top