Howto: Have hot washer fluid all-year-round

MOGolf

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Joined
Jun 27, 2001
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underneath something
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2001 Golf GLS TDI Reflex silver, rough road suspension and steel skid plate, 2004 Passat Variant, Candy White, rough road suspension and geared balanced shaft module, and much, much more. 2016 LR RR HSE TD6, 2019 Jaguar I-PACE
Note: I am not associated with any company mentioned here. This is not a solicited, nor paid for, endorsement.

Since I didn't get the cold weather package on mine, I don't have heated windscreen washer nozzles. From what I understand, the heating only keeps them from freezing up in the cold weather. I've not had that problem anyway. However, I have had the fluid freeze on the windscreen once dispensed.

As I was wandering through the net one day, some time ago, I came across the product Safe-Vue from Rostra Precision Controls, Inc. This device is claimed to heat the washer fluid to a maximum of 170*F in 2.5 to 3 minutes. It is supposed to heat the fluid to 50*F in the first 90 seconds.

So I said, let's give a try. They do not list the '01 VW Golf as an application but by selecting various other models it looks like "one size fits all". I called and ordered kit #250-6652.

The kit arrived just a couple of days later. The contents are:

A warranty tag
The heater with lugged earth wire, power wire with integral weathertight 15A fuse, and integrated mounting bracket
A bag with a short piece of tubing, 4 tubing connectors (2 with small diameter on both ends and 2 with large and small ends), and 4 mounting screws
A bag with a spare fuse, medium length piece of tubing and 2 longer mounting screws
A long piece of tubing
Instructions


Next was to decide the mounting location. Well, ok, I already knew where to mount it. Several months ago I called and got general dimensions of the heater. With that knowledge I determined that the only real place to mount it on my A4 was in the wheel well area behind the right front wing. So I lifted the car and supported it, removed the right front wheel, removed the 12 T-25 Torx screws that hold the liner in place, then the liner. There is a space just large enough for the heater back towards the door and below the side turn signal lamp.



Conveniently located here is a stud that will serve as the mounting point for the heater. This is also where the washer fluid tubing passes through from the engine compartment/plenum to loop up to the nozzles on the bonnet as seen at the top of the picture. The wiring to the signal lamp is located here, too.

I disconnected the signal lamp to avoid cutting it while using a sharp utility knife to cut the existing washer tubing. Then I inserted a tubing connector from the kit (small diameter on both halves) into the short piece of tubing that came with the kit and then pushed it into one half of the sliced tubing (seen mostly installed). Note: this takes firm, slow insertion so you don't break the tubing connector. The car's tubing is more rigid than the kit's tubing. Then I repeated that for the other half of the spliced tubing with a suitable length of tubing cut from the other tubing in the kit.


I mounted the heater to the stud, pushing the earth lug on first, and using a M6x1.0 nut. The weathertight fuse was pushed through the opening into the plenum. The tubing from the washer pump was pushed onto the inlet tube to the heater (closest to the bracket) and the tubing to the nozzles was pushed onto the outlet. I have also added a couple of wireties pulled tight around these tubing connections to increase friction (not pictured). The tubing is not flared, and the inlet side blew off once since installation. Hopefully that won't happen again.



Having completed that part of the installation it was time to move on to the wiring. Since the heater needs a source of electrical supply that is hot only when the ignition is on, I decided to run the wiring to the 75X connection at the base of the relay panel. If you are not familiar with this panel, see this thread.

To run the wire to that location requires removing the plenum cover and that means removing the wipers and wiper linkage. Start by removing the little round caps (they just pry off) over the wiper securing nuts. Then remove the wiper securing nuts with a 13mm socket. Then remove the wiper arms from the wiper linkage. They just pull off (may be difficult). DO NOT do anything to pry against the windscreen glass nor allow the wiper arms to spring back against it. Remove the long rubber strip along the engine compartment edge of the cover (it just pulls off) and remove the pollen filter cover (4 screws that may be Phillips or Torx head). At the base of the A-pillar on each side, on the inside of the wing panel are plastic trim pieces. They pull off to remove. Next grasp the plenum cover along the windscreen edge at one side of the car and pull it away from the windscreen. DO NOT do anything to pry against the glass. Just pull it straight away and then work your way across the car. Lift off the cover and place aside. Next remove the wiper linkage by removing the (3) 13mm head mounting bolts, disconnect the motor wiring, and lifting out.

Once you've got this far, you'll see the cover for where the wiring passes into the passenger compartment above the relay panel. Unsnap the lid and lift out. On one side is a seal with wires running through and the other seal has no wires (assuming North American stock configuration). I poked a hole in the no-wire seal and pushed a wire through it and down to the relay panel as seen in this picture.



I ran the wire across the plenum and secured it in several places with wire ties. A simple butt connector was used to join the wire to the heater wire. The connector was then encased in sealant from Radio Shack (the roll can be seen at the lower right of this picture.



Before completing the wiring, I operated the washer pump until the fluid squirted onto the windscreen. This fills the heater. The instructions clearly state to do this and there is a big caution to NEVER allow the system to run out of fluid. If you do, it will damage the unit.

I completed the wiring by using a splice connector to attach the wire to another wire I already had attached to the 75X terminal. If you don't have one, just use a ring connector and secure the wire to the 75X terminal. Once connected, turn the ignition on and wait a couple of minutes. You should be able to feel warmth when touching the heater.

If it does not get warm, trouble shoot the wiring connections. If it gets warm, then reassemble everything in reverse sequence of disassembly. Be sure to tighten the wiper nuts to 15 ft-lbs. and the lug bolts to 87-89 ft-lbs and lower the car back to ground level.

Thus completes the Rostra Safe-Vue Heater installation.

I'll have to report back when it gets cold and let you know how well it really works.
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Very cool. I bet it works great. Nice install.

One thing I'd like to pass along. About the water tight box and running wires through the new grommet. I'm not sure if it's how I taped my wires up or not, but I had some water inside the car and couldn't figure out where it came from.

It wasn't at a low spot, and it didn't come from the opening and closing of the door, or my foot.

The only thing I could "guess" where the source of water might be are the wires that I've used in this extra grommet. Keep in mind, I've probably got 8-10 wires running through this location.

So, with Silcone sealant in hand, I opened up the box and coated the wires inside the grommet to seal any channel that water could "migrate" through capillary action into the car.

I have no idea if this is where the water is coming from, but it has since rained and no water.

I'll keep an eye out at the spot at the floor, but so far so good. I dread having to try and find another way for water to get into the car.

If you take a look at a 2002, they changed the wiring grommet and how it's sealed. They use something very hard to achieve this seal as well.

Sorry for going on a tangent, Glen. I just wasn't sure where I could post this for others. Hope you don't mind on what is a very nice install of the wiper fluid heater.

Lito
 

Tyler Gee

Veteran Member
Joined
May 27, 2001
Location
SF Bay Area
TDI
98 NB, 00 Jetta
I know its really low-tech but all I did was take a length of soft copper tubing and patch it into the washer hose coming out of the pump and run a few loops of it around the exhaust manifold before rejoining the rubber hose leadinng to the spray nozzles.
 

MOGolf

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Joined
Jun 27, 2001
Location
underneath something
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2001 Golf GLS TDI Reflex silver, rough road suspension and steel skid plate, 2004 Passat Variant, Candy White, rough road suspension and geared balanced shaft module, and much, much more. 2016 LR RR HSE TD6, 2019 Jaguar I-PACE
Not a problem, Lito. Since I just poked the hole with an awl and then a single wire through it, the grommet is sealing against the wire. If there were more wires going through the same opening in the grommet, the use of silicone sealant or the Radio Shack sealant should be used. Thanks for the reminding tip.
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Glen,

Should your wiring needs expand, I've got a spare OEM grommet that you're welcome to have.

L
 

tongsli

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2000
Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Tyler Gee said:
I know its really low-tech but all I did was take a length of soft copper tubing and patch it into the washer hose coming out of the pump and run a few loops of it around the exhaust manifold before rejoining the rubber hose leadinng to the spray nozzles.
LOL! I love it. A home made distillery. Neat idea. Only problem is if the car has been sitting and it's frozen it would take a while to get things warmed up.

That's the beauty of Glen's install, instant heat.

L
 

MOGolf

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Joined
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Location
underneath something
TDI
2001 Golf GLS TDI Reflex silver, rough road suspension and steel skid plate, 2004 Passat Variant, Candy White, rough road suspension and geared balanced shaft module, and much, much more. 2016 LR RR HSE TD6, 2019 Jaguar I-PACE
tongsli said:
Glen,

Should your wiring needs expand, I've got a spare OEM grommet that you're welcome to have.

L
Thanks. Hang on to it for when I come over and we wire up the oil sensor. (parts backordered)

Tyler does have an interesting "poor man's" solution for heating the fluid. However, I ponder if over a period of time vibration will cause a hole or two to be worn through the tubing, or corrosion of the copper will provide a nice green patina to spread over other parts of the car, driveway, garage floor... But then he doesn't live in the Midwest with its wintery climate and seasoned
roads.

Keep us updated on this, Tyler.
 

MOGolf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
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Location
underneath something
TDI
2001 Golf GLS TDI Reflex silver, rough road suspension and steel skid plate, 2004 Passat Variant, Candy White, rough road suspension and geared balanced shaft module, and much, much more. 2016 LR RR HSE TD6, 2019 Jaguar I-PACE
I didn't ask. I just put it on one the pieces of plastic in pocket. I've got so much credit, it's hard to sit.


Actually, based on going through the web site ordering process and comparing to what showed up on my CC, it was cheaper to call them on their 800 number and place the order.


So I guess "prices subject to change without notice and competency of the order taker".
 

jtroyce

Veteran Member
Joined
May 30, 2002
Location
Nashua, NH
TDI
2001 Jetta GL TDI (sold)
Tyler Gee said:
I know its really low-tech but all I did was take a length of soft copper tubing and patch it into the washer hose coming out of the pump and run a few loops of it around the exhaust manifold before rejoining the rubber hose leadinng to the spray nozzles.
Neat idea. I wonder though--is the copper in contact with the exhaust manifold? If so, doesn't it get hot enough to boil the washer fluid that is present inside the tubing? I would think that manifold must get awfully hot.
 

MOGolf

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Joined
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underneath something
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2001 Golf GLS TDI Reflex silver, rough road suspension and steel skid plate, 2004 Passat Variant, Candy White, rough road suspension and geared balanced shaft module, and much, much more. 2016 LR RR HSE TD6, 2019 Jaguar I-PACE
Reporting back as I stated in the first post.

I haven't had the opportunity to have it parked where it got frost on the windows yet. Having a garage tends to do that. I have operated the washers in the cold weather to clean off road spray, though. There is definitely hot fluid being sprayed as indicated by fog/steam that rises off the windshield and out of the nozzles.

The windshield seems to come clean much better than without the heated fluid. /images/graemlins/smile.gif
 

Michael Moore

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2001
Location
Toronto / Zürich
TDI
2004 Phaeton W12, 2015 Golf Highline (gas)
Tyler:

Sounds interesting. Do you have any concerns about the possible effects of spraying really hot fluid on really cold glass (cracking), or do you think the fluid temperature will drop somewhat once it starts running through the lines and soaring through the air onto the glass?

Also, do you have any concern about the alcohol (anti-freeze component) evaporating out of the fluid that is in the copper line if you drive for a few days without using the washers? I'm sort of wondering if what you would get then would be very hot fluid, but with no residual anti-freezing properties.

Reason I ask is that when aircraft are being de-iced with fluids that contain alcohol (not common - normally it is glycol based), once the batch has been heated, it either gets uses or gets thrown out, one of the two. The concern is that alcohol evaporates out at a lower temperature than the water base boils at.

Michael
 

Birdman

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Near Hagerstown MD.
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Jetta 2001 Died by Truck one snowy day. Jetta 2003
Looks like it will work better then the stock setup which i have used to de-ice my windshield but took alot of fluid to get there.
 

Tyler Gee

Veteran Member
Joined
May 27, 2001
Location
SF Bay Area
TDI
98 NB, 00 Jetta
Actually it will boil off all the fluid in the copper section in time if you don't use the washer very often. The idea is that the fresh fluid being pumped through the tubing will be heated on the way to the spray nozzles. This of course means the longer you spray the less heated the water will be. The only downside of rigging it this way is that some times the wipers are running for a bit before it sprays anything.

I once had an Isuzu that that was designed so that it would run the pump for about a quarter second before starting the wiper when using the washer so the wiper wasn't dragging across a dry windshield. It had only one wiper but it swept almost 180 degrees so it was lotsa fun to use it when stopped at a red light with someone on the left. It would wet the windshield down throughly and then with one big sweep, fling all of the dirty water almost 4 feet into the air and to the left leaving a mess on anyone in the lane to the left of me.
 

Dean_S

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Mar 29, 2001
Location
Lawrence Kansas
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BMW 535d x-drive
I am also concerned about the alchohol in the fluid boiling. The copper tube around the exhaust manifold sounds quite dangerous. In the summer the temperatures could be very high.

The heater is thermostatically controlled. So the fluid should not boil in the heater. By the time the fluid hits the windshield the temperature will have been muted by flowing through the cold hoses and throught the air.
 

Tyler Gee

Veteran Member
Joined
May 27, 2001
Location
SF Bay Area
TDI
98 NB, 00 Jetta
[ QUOTE ]
I am also concerned about the alchohol in the fluid boiling. The copper tube around the exhaust manifold sounds quite dangerous. In the summer the temperatures could be very high.

The heater is thermostatically controlled. So the fluid should not boil in the heater. By the time the fluid hits the windshield the temperature will have been muted by flowing through the cold hoses and throught the air.

[/ QUOTE ]The alcohol vaporizes long before the water boils off so it is not a problem and not all premixed washer fluid contains alcohol anyway. The copper tubing can't get any hotter than the manifold and the egt after the turbo gets done with it isn't all that hot compared to a gasser. The short piece of rubber washer hose on both ends of the copper tubing have never shown any signs of damage from the heat off the copper tubing.
 

tongsli

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Joined
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Location
Baltimore, MD
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2004, Jetta Wagon TDI PD
Update:

After finding out during my first install attempt that my Jetta doesn't have the same post stud in Glen's GOLF, I had to come up with a different mounting system.

I used long self-tapping sheet metal screws with 1/4" nylon spacers. Each sheet metal screw included the rubber coated washer used on duct work. I put the rubber washer against the car fender.

I forgot the camera so the next time I take my wheels off(spring) I will remove the liner and snap some pictures.

The OEM washer tube is very hard and really TOUGH to insert the plastic studs for splicing. Man oh man. I had to use some pliers to grip two ends and pull the pliers together to get them together.

Per Glen's suggestion, I used some small clamps to keep the hoses secure.

I ended up replacing the Jetta wiper stalk with the Golf stalk so that I have a forward push. I had a golf washer motor lying around, which has two nipples, and am using it.

The car is wired for the Golf or Jetta stalk. When the Golf stalk is used and pushed forward, it operates the motor of the second nipple which is routed to my heating element.

So, I pull for <font color="blue"> Cold </font> fluid and push for <font color="red">HOT </font> fluid.

L
 

Bob_Fout

Oil Wanker
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Sep 5, 2004
Location
Indiana
TDI
2003 Jetta - Alaska Green (sold) / 2015 GTI 2.0T
I wonder if windshields are made to withstand the temp deltas, like pyrex?
 

DanG144

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Aug 2, 2007
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Chapin, South Carolina, USA
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2005 A4 Jetta 5spd
windshield and temperature change

I had an old pickup in Idaho. I never used the block heater but once. It was -26 F. The pickup cranked up fine. Plenty of hot air. (It was a 2500 watt heater !!)

I turned on the hot defroster and the windshield shattered into a thousand pieces. Of course it may have had a crack in it previously - but I did not remember one.

Dan
 

LNXGUY

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Jan 10, 2004
Location
Barrie, Ont, Canada
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'05 Jetta TDI Wagon
A zerostart keeps everything underneath the hood nice and toasty. I wouldn't be putting warm anything on a windshield that's been out in -30 degree temps.
 

speed185187

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Hartland, MI
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Case 580 Super M,
Eh, just finding out that i have alot of free time when i'm not driving in my TDI. And i actually like tech/geek stuff
 
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