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Fuels & Lubricants Discussion all about Fuels & Lubricants. synthetic oil, conventional oil, brands, change intervals, diesel grades, gelling and such debated items like that. Non TDI related postings will be moved or removed. This forum is NOT for the discussion of biodiesel and other alternative fuels.

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Old August 12th, 2008, 23:11   #46
Zambee500
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I posted this in another thread about "cheap" prices for diesel fuel. Anybody looked into fuel quality at QuikTrip stations? They're pretty much limited to locations in the Midwest, Phoenix, Dallas, and Atlanta. They advertise heavily here in Atlanta and seem to pride themselves on their fuel quality for gasoline, but I have no idea about their diesel fuel. Their "Travel Centers" (i.e., truck stops) seem to be the only locations with diesel pumps (although both truck and regular pumps), and the location 10 miles south of town has been 30-50 cents per gallon cheaper than the competition the past several weeks. So I've been filling up there the past 4 or 5 tanks. Car has seemingly run really well too, and the last tank got a 1-2 mpg boost over our average. I did switch from Stanadyne Performance Formula to the gray Power Service Diesel Kleen on the last fill-up, so it could be that, or just an anamoly in Atlanta rush-hour traffic (summer vacationers typically lighten the travel volume for rush hour during summer months).

Anyway, we've pretty much stuck exclusively with BP and Shell, with the occasional Sam's Club fill-up, since we bought our TDI 14 months ago. But I think I can get used to QuikTrip at these prices with no apparent adverse effects. Filled up tonight for $4.11/gallon while the Shell station a mile from the house is still at $4.79/gallon. It seems worth the extra half-hour and burned fuel getting there to save $10 on a fill-up, and the spotless pumps and clean stores with friendly/literate staff certainly don't hurt either.
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Last edited by Zambee500; August 12th, 2008 at 23:18.
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Old November 11th, 2009, 11:24   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10then34
As pointed out, with few exceptions (e.g. the Koch stuff), diesel fuel for the most part is whatever the local pipeline terminal has in their tank. It turns into 'shell' 'exxon' or 'superfragilicious' after someone dumps a jug of that particular marketers additive package into the tanker.
+1. In this part of the world, I have observed the same fuel truck visit several different branded stations for delivery in the same day.
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Old November 11th, 2009, 13:44   #48
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My best tank was from Chevron.

Phillips brands have been hit an miss for me, Exxon as well. I've had bad tanks with some local Shell B2, but honestly, the biggest effect on my MPG is how much time I drive in town, and if it's raining. If I'm in town a lot, or if it's raining a lot, I lose 2-3 mpg off a tank.

P.
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Old November 11th, 2009, 13:55   #49
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hess is actually pretty crappy, and usually 20 cents cheaper. i go for sunoco, shell, bp. i think the best fuel is from a pump that is constantly being used so you know the fuel isnt old.
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Old November 11th, 2009, 14:33   #50
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From one of my posts in another thread:

Well I got a response back from Cenex Fuels or CHS as they are formally known and this is what they said about their Roadmaster Premium diesel. I was pleasantly surpised by the lubricity standards:

Hello Paul,

Thank you for your questions regarding Cenex Roadmaster XL.

Our specs are a minimum 45 cetane but it is typically 47 or better and 440-460 HFRR (High Frequency Reciprocating Rig which is a fuel lubricity test) meets OEM recommendations. Cenex Roadmaster XL on it's own doesn't have cold flow improvers to reduce CFPP.

A typical #2 fuel may have a cetane as low as 40 and HFRR at 520. The HFRR test the lower the number the better.

Our Wintermaster product is a combination of #1 and #2 fuel with our Cenex Roadmaster XL additive and a cold flow improver and is good to -30F. The cold flow improver has Wax anti-settling agents and deicers within the cold flow package to help extend operabilty.

Please let me know if you have any more questions!

I found a good article regarding this HFRR test by ASTM:
Found Here

Also, nice thing to know is, this stuff meets the Euro EN590 maximum wear spec of 460.
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Old November 12th, 2009, 21:23   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lkchris
Well, when I started hauling fuel many years ago when ARCO was still on the east coast, their standard was to shut down the pumps while I was dropping the load and for at least a half hour after I left the station. Then they hired some beancounters and things changed.

And it is okay if the particles of dirt and sludge (and water) were to stay on top of the fuel, but it doesn't. It gets stirred up and is mixed with the fuel. The pump intake pipe in the tank is about 7 or 8 inches up from the bottom of the tank. Once all the stuff has settled to the bottom of the tank it is safe to pump again. About 30 minutes after the fuel transport leaves. That gives a actual settle time of at least 50 minutes to a hour, considering unhooking time and paperwork.

As to the snopes viewpoint, I have pumped out tanks and seen what is on the bottom of them. The filters they talk about are not any larger than a engine motor oil filter. And they don't change them as often as they should. And they by-pass. After hauling fuel to stations, trucking companies, bus companies, and air ports for over 20 years, I will wait until the transport is long gone no matter what Snopes says !!! Both diesel or gas.

And I have still gotten bad fuel. But then I have unknowingly hauled bad fuel that we had to haul back to the refinery. It happens, and it does not matter what the name of the fuel is!!! The best of them have their problems.
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Old November 21st, 2009, 06:17   #52
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I'll bet with ULSD being required as of December 1st in ALL stations, that the quality won't vary much. I once fueled up at a station near New Orleans and bought their diesel completely water white. Think it was the station brand bought by BP. Not sure there are many additives in diesel. Oil companies getting very paraffinic crudes could be getting diesel with a higher cetane index, but I'll bet it'll vary greatly depending on the region of the country you're in and time of year, etc.

I've driven diesels for 31 years. 'twere Mercedes up until this new TDI. I gave up on MB ever giving me another stick shift diesel. Our diesels burn almost exclusively (except for those rare cases like that station in NO) Exxon because I get 10% off the non-taxed price.
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Old November 21st, 2009, 06:31   #53
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In 31 years of driving a diesel, I've only had the fuel filter plug ONCE and actually NO water problems. The lone fuel filter plug was likely caused by my starting to use B5. The bio in B5 likely cleaned out the tank and caused that cleaned out stuff to plug the filter after the 3rd tank. This occurred to a friend of mine who drives a TDI after she switched to using bio, too. She doesn't remember how many tankfuls it took.

I have an auxiliary filter that includes a water drain on the shelf in my garage. Think I bought it in 1984 when we bought the year old 240D to replace our 220D. I couldn't figure out how to put the auxiliary in there and look nice. On the TDI, it really has little space to add such a thing.

Also, I have to caution against adding auxilliary filters and such that end up very far from the engine because Mercedes' design of placing their fuel filters right up against the engine helped us get through a bit of gelling of the fuel on a -22 F morning. It was on the old 220D. I'd added a rad hose heater on it that I plugged in that morning. After heating for 30 minutes or so and glowing for about a minute, the engine fired immediately to life. About 2 or 3 miles down the road, it quit. Let it sit for 2 or 3 minutes. Fired right up. Drove another 2 or 3 miles before it quit again. Let it sit 2 or 3 minutes. Then it fired right up and kept going. With a filter out in the cold, I'd probably have been stuck that morning. I learned about adding some kerosene for the winter in Vermont after that.

Still, I'm getting a spare fuel filter to carry in the trunk of the TDI and have that torx screwdriver to remove the screws on the top of the filter housing. When I change filters out, I just use that one and get a new one to store away.
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Old November 21st, 2009, 06:45   #54
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Those of you who think that brands are different, try following the tanker truck from the station back to the fuel farm. Most parts of the country only have one choice. I don't know what the add to the fuel once it's in the tanker, however.
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Old November 21st, 2009, 14:46   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhdenney
Someone correct me if I am wrong but it seems that the underground temperature where the tank lies will remain somewhat static. Above ground tanks might be a different story but those are kinda few and a thing of the past.
I have been at a Sunoco in Alma ,VA to hang out not to fill up. This station has an above ground diesel tank. It has the best diesel price in the area.
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Old November 25th, 2009, 10:33   #56
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Just want to throw out that for the U.S. BMW recommends BP/Amoco diesel (probably due to higher Cetane of the premium diesel). BMW recommends Cetane of 50 or higher. Per BP website: "Amoco Premier Diesel meets a minimum 47 cetane rating. "

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