2009 TDI fuel economy

[alnmike]

Originally Posted by TornadoRed

That's why taking an average of 3-5 tanks is necessary to get an accurate calculated number. That's why I said it would take 2,000-3,000 miles of driving.

He knows this, that's why he said that he will continue writing it down. I, for one appreciate him coming to us with the only info he has, and that's more info than I've seen anywhere so far.

And about the prius, if someone has data for more than 5k miles, I'll believe them. If someone has lifetime average over 100k miles that the display is almost exactly what pen and paper say then they're right, the bladder doesn't matter.
A lifetime average only differs between first and last fillup. All the middle ones mean nothing. If he filled it 10 gallon the first time and 6 the last, then over the course of 100,000 miles, he's off by 4 gallons. That's not bad at all, do you document every ounce of powerservice you add?

[jvance]

Originally Posted by SBAtdijetta

I have read a bit on those forums, and some of their "stories" seem like just that... That said the MFD may be pretty accurate but I still don't believe it is dead on, and it will vary from car to car, and tank to tank. All in all I don't buy it, nor would I ever buy a Prius...


I am not totally disagreeing with you but this test was only 160 miles... So not enough to be accurate, esp. w/ the supposed Prius tank bladder; however that thing is real convenient… to not being able to measure actual MPG pen and paper so you have to listen to the MFD..., again I don’t buy it but I don’t know how much the MFD is lying because you can’t measure one tank accurately according to most due to the tank bladder.

Here - read this thread:

http://priuschat.com/forums/prius-main-forum/25900-accurate-mpg-display.html

EDIT: a better thread:

http://priuschat.com/forums/prius-te...adsheet-2.html

Or one of many others there.

They're putting their MFI readings, mileage and fuel purchases into spreadsheets and calculating lifetime average differences of 1mpg or less. I'll take 25k worth of meticulously entered mileage data over some half drunk "journalist" who probably couldn't find the right hole to stick the pump in with both hands and a flashlight.

But of course these people aren't moral, upstanding and trustworthy TDI owners. They're shifty (actually shiftless - CVT) lying Prius owners, so the whole thread is a pack of lies.

[JonFord]

You mean there are Toyota Shills in here.

[jvance]

Originally Posted by JonFord

You mean there are Toyota Shills in here.

No. Truth has no affiliation. You should prefer truth, even when it doesn't match your preconceived notions.

[jvance]

Originally Posted by wesk1954

Okay, as promised, checked the mileage today for a comparison on the new JETTA. The electronics said my tank averaged 45.0 and the actual calculation resulted in 43.6. This was about 150 city and 300 highway with mixed a/c usage.

Based on wesk1954 and others' initial reports, we can assume that the MFI is calibrated accurately.

Expect 50mpg highway out of the new TDI at a steady 65mph. Expect this to improve over the first 20k miles to what - 55mpg? 60?

It's looking an awful lot like VW is delivering on its promise.

Now if only they would deliver my %$#@ Sportwagen!

[Fencemaker]

Originally Posted by alnmike
do you document every ounce of powerservice you add?

I'm so anal about caluclating mpg that I actually do document every ounce of powerservice I add.

Not sure if that is good or bad but at least what I'm reporting is an accurate report of how many miles I went on whatever made its way into my fuel tank.

[Mrstacy]

Where do I begin? After giving up on local dealers that wanted 2.5 k over sticker, I finally settled on a silver/black dsg loyal edition in LA for 1k over sticker - the loyal edition at 1k over is a better value than a non-loyal at sticker (correct me if I am wrong).

Anyways, I arrive in LA and fill out all the paperwork and the salesman starts to kill time by telling me all the prepping they are doing to the car to make it perfect for me to drive off.

Then like a bolt of lightening struck him, he goes into a panic. It turns out that he had sent the porter on a fuel run to fill up my car. Apparently the porter didn't know how to read English very well and was sent to the gas station with no specific instructions as to what fuel the car takes. Chaos breaks out in the showroom. Everyone is pulling out his or her cell phone to try to reach the porter.

Other people are logging on the internet to get the phone number of the gas station to catch him before he actually starts the car - they seemed to have assumed he's already fueled it given the length of time that went by.

Unfortunately, they need a Spanish speaking person so they track down one of the people that knows the language, but they realize that he didn't carry a cell.

They are doing this in a controlled way because me, the customer, is sitting there observing all this take place. I see them looking out of the corner of their eyes trying to see whether I'm aware of what is going on. I pretend that I'm unaware all the time trying to gauge their reaction as to whether they ruined the engine or not.

I begin to sense that helplessness of the situation. I excuse myself from the finance office and begin to call all of my Southern CA contacts that I had emailed earlier. There is a silver/grey loyal tdi in ontario. I explain the situation that I'll buy it today if they come pick me up. It is 6 pm and they close at 9 pm. It is still rush hour. The salesman says he'll call the sales manager.

A few minutes later my salesperson comes in and confirms my worst fears. The car was filled with gasoline and has to undergo an extensive fuel system cleaning process - they can't sell me the car. Perhaps I'd like a different color combination.

So, here I am 300 miles away from home stranded. The sales manager in Ontario sensing his leverage tries to re-negotiate the deal I had with the salesman. Can I pay $250 more? I'll have to think about it. He says it is probably too late to send someone since they have reduced staff this late in the day. In the meantime I ask him if the metrolink train stops in Ontario and what is the phone number?

Then my salesman in LA suggests a blue/grey loyal dsg. I was steadfast against it earlier, but I take a second look. Not bad I think secretly. Perhaps they'll feel somewhat guilty and drop the price.

Bottom line is that I bought the blue/grey loyal (even got a price break) and really like it. I averaged 44.2 mpg (on the computer) and was impressed with the torque on this car - very fun to drive.

sorry for the long post, but needed to vent.

[TornadoRed]

This story will be repeated dozens of times -- though hopefully not at the same dealerships.

[seespotrun]

Is it ok to coast downhill with it in neutral? I have been doing that a lot and saving gas w/ my new tdi and just want to make certain that it is ok.

[Kabin]

For those interested in "real world" Prius MPGs, the folks at Google have been driving an assortment of hybrids and some are upgraded with aftermarket plug-in lithium ion batteries. The cars have data acquisition systems and data is collected and put it on the following website daily. Much more information than I've seen anywhere else.

http://www.google.org/recharge/dashboard

[TornadoRed]

Originally Posted by seespotrun

Is it ok to coast downhill with it in neutral? I have been doing that a lot and saving gas w/ my new tdi and just want to make certain that it is ok.

This has been widely discussed, and the general conclusion is that coasting in neutral will not save fuel and it might actually use more.

Traveling downhill in gear, with your foot off the accelerator, the engine is not using any fuel at all -- the ECM doesn't order the injection of any fuel unless it's needed. If you push in the clutch or shift to neutral, then the engine will need to use a small amount of fuel to maintain idle speed.

The reason there is no absolute answer for every situation is that we don't know how much fuel will be used to climb the next hill. But since coasting downhill in neutral is illegal in most states, and it probably consumes more fuel than it saves, there just doesn't seem to be a good reason to do it.

[seespotrun]

Thank you, I will refrain from doing it from now on if it doesn't help.

[Rod Bearing]

You have every right to provide your catty retorts. A word of advice though. It's better for you to be thought of as a fool that posts here than to continue to spew your nonsense and remove all doubt for the rest of us.

Originally Posted by jvance

Here - read this thread:

http://priuschat.com/forums/prius-main-forum/25900-accurate-mpg-display.html

EDIT: a better thread:

http://priuschat.com/forums/prius-te...adsheet-2.html

Or one of many others there.

They're putting their MFI readings, mileage and fuel purchases into spreadsheets and calculating lifetime average differences of 1mpg or less. I'll take 25k worth of meticulously entered mileage data over some half drunk "journalist" who probably couldn't find the right hole to stick the pump in with both hands and a flashlight.

But of course these people aren't moral, upstanding and trustworthy TDI owners. They're shifty (actually shiftless - CVT) lying Prius owners, so the whole thread is a pack of lies.

[NMRJock]

Originally Posted by Rod Bearing

You have every right to provide your catty retorts. A word of advice though. It's better for you to be thought of as a fool that posts here than to continue to spew your nonsense and remove all doubt for the rest of us.

He posted links to data gathered by actual owners. You may not agree with it, but it's hardly fair to categorize it as 'nonsense.'

I don't understand this Us vs. Them, TDI vs. Prius/Hybrid feud.

Most here will agree that the TDI is a great car. It's especially great at racking up lots and lots of highway miles efficiently.

The Prius is a great car too. It gets really good gas mileage on the highway, and great gas mileage in city driving under conditions that suit it.

It's so strange to me that so many TDI owners can't see any virtue in the Prius. It's just like some hillbilly screaming Ford sucks because he drives a Chevy. Maybe it's all a symptom of the two-party nature of the US. If you're a Republican, everything liberal is stupid. If you're a Democrat, everything conservative is stupid. Nevermind that very few people really agree with the entire platform of the party they identify with...

[bayshorecs]

Originally Posted by seespotrun

Is it ok to coast downhill with it in neutral? I have been doing that a lot and saving gas w/ my new tdi and just want to make certain that it is ok.

Another way you can tell coasting in gear uses "less" fuel is through the EGT. While coasting in gear with PP520s, my EGT is around 250F-260F. While idle/clutch pressed in, it is 300F+.