mk3 move to mk4 3bar map sensor, iat transfer over also?

kooyajerms

grocery getter
Joined
May 5, 2004
Location
Pomona, Southern California
TDI
97 B4V (mine), 11 x5 35d (hers) 04 V10 (that one you want), 2014 Q7 (mom's) 74 Shasta 1400
So I'm going to use the mk4 3bar map sensor and weld on the bracket to the new IC pipes.

Do I need to worry about anything else in regards to the IAT's being read from the different map sensor?

Obviously it needs to be soldered into the ecu still, but is that it? MAP/IAT sensor all in one without any other modifications? (Yes the ECU is getting remapped).

Thanks.


Jeremy
 
Last edited:

turbo johan

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2006
Yes, goes without troubles.
I've done it a few times.
Mostly i now use 300 kPa sensor for soldering in the ecu as a replacement.
Bit easier..

Johan
 

12MPGHWY

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2008
Location
el California
TDI
none
what part number as sensor?

Do you remove the sensor itself from the housing?

turbo johan said:
Yes, goes without troubles.
I've done it a few times.
Mostly i now use 300 kPa sensor for soldering in the ecu as a replacement.
Bit easier..

Johan
 

jsrmonster

Veteran Member - TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Apr 22, 2002
Location
Red Lion, PA
TDI
15 Golf SW DSG, RC3 piped, 99.5 Jetta Rocket PD150 6spd 4motion, 2000 ASV110 RC6 "Silverbullet" 5spd Race Car, 2003.5 Cummins QCLB 4x4 "Blue Monster" Jeep CRD juiced, MB Sprinter van juiced up
I just use the mk4 3bar map and install it into the ecu with piece of tubing, vacuum line, and adapters, and wire ties. It's a seamless integration, imho.

Take a wizzer and clean off the mounting tabs, and solder up the appropiate wires, and remap the "correct" sensor calibration into your tune.

Jeff
 

12MPGHWY

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2008
Location
el California
TDI
none
You put the Mk4 3bar map inside the ecu case?

So you take the map sensor itself out of its housing is that correct?

jsrmonster said:
I just use the mk4 3bar map and install it into the ecu with piece of tubing, vacuum line, and adapters, and wire ties. It's a seamless integration, imho.

Take a wizzer and clean off the mounting tabs, and solder up the appropiate wires, and remap the "correct" sensor calibration into your tune.

Jeff
 

ryanp

Vendor
Joined
Jun 22, 2008
Location
Barnsley, South Yorkshire, UK
TDI
Arosa CR - 550hp - 9.7 @ 150mph 1/4 Mile, Citigo 4x4 CR TDi - 340hp, Caddy 2.0 CR 4x4 TDI - 300+hp, Golf Mk2 Van 1.9 TDI - was 290hp, Mk5 Ibiza 2.0 FR TDi - 270hp, BMW 135d - 360hp, BMW 330d - 335hp, BMW 335d - 380hp + a few more ........
This is just the topic i've been looking for!

I've got this ECU:


and this MAP sensor:


I'm wanting to make them work an a 1Z TDi with a maf delete, it's been de-immobilised already but i also know i need to solder a socket and fit chips but i have NO idea what to do or what i need! how do i reflash the chips?

Any liks would help too!

Thanks!

Ryan
 

Rub87

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 10, 2006
Location
Belgium
TDI
Ibiza '99 90HP
check the pics from satiro, it's the cleaned and best solution, this way you don't need separate map and iat sensor anymore..
 

12MPGHWY

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2008
Location
el California
TDI
none
I did this last week and left the sensor in the cowl attached to a bracket.

Is there a better way to do it, such as a place to attach it to the MK3's stock inter cooler pipe like in place of the original intake temperature sensor?

What I am really looking for is an easy way to make a bushing to go from the Mk4 map sensor to the Mk3 intake temp sensor, or even better to purchase one.
 

ryanp

Vendor
Joined
Jun 22, 2008
Location
Barnsley, South Yorkshire, UK
TDI
Arosa CR - 550hp - 9.7 @ 150mph 1/4 Mile, Citigo 4x4 CR TDi - 340hp, Caddy 2.0 CR 4x4 TDI - 300+hp, Golf Mk2 Van 1.9 TDI - was 290hp, Mk5 Ibiza 2.0 FR TDi - 270hp, BMW 135d - 360hp, BMW 330d - 335hp, BMW 335d - 380hp + a few more ........
I've got SS boost pipes so a friend is making up a SS boss and welding it in the place of the Mk3 OE IAT sensor, I'll then run the two MAP wires to the ECU.

Just need the wiring Pin outs!

Ryan
 

kooyajerms

grocery getter
Joined
May 5, 2004
Location
Pomona, Southern California
TDI
97 B4V (mine), 11 x5 35d (hers) 04 V10 (that one you want), 2014 Q7 (mom's) 74 Shasta 1400
I have yet to do it Ryan, but wanted to post the answer.

Rub87 said:
Pin
Description
Wire color
Connected to
1
Signal ground
Brown/blue
pin 25 of the ECU
2
Temperature output voltage
Grey/green
pin 13 of the ECU
3
5V supply and reference voltage
Purple/red
pin 39 of the ECU
4
Pressure output voltage
Yellow/black
Pin 40 of the ECU​

Here is the pin layout of a IC mount map sensor..

The middle wire in the ecu one is signal out, and I think the front is +5v (not sure so measure it), I only used 2 wires from the ecu (+5v and signal out), the ground and IAT signal I used from the separate IAT sensor found on the AFN engine..
Though there would be an audible in regards to how Ruben wired it.
 

ryanp

Vendor
Joined
Jun 22, 2008
Location
Barnsley, South Yorkshire, UK
TDI
Arosa CR - 550hp - 9.7 @ 150mph 1/4 Mile, Citigo 4x4 CR TDi - 340hp, Caddy 2.0 CR 4x4 TDI - 300+hp, Golf Mk2 Van 1.9 TDI - was 290hp, Mk5 Ibiza 2.0 FR TDi - 270hp, BMW 135d - 360hp, BMW 330d - 335hp, BMW 335d - 380hp + a few more ........
The wires are soldered into the ECU and i have had the boss made. Just need to weld it in where the old IAT sensor goes, De-pin the IAT and wire the new sensor up.

Hopefully when it's done i'll have enough pics to make some sort of guide to help anyone else who carries this out!

I'd also like to see some pics of the method described by Jeff and Johan! sounds cleaner and easier in some respects.
 
Last edited:

12MPGHWY

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2008
Location
el California
TDI
none
I considered doing that but then you lose the ability to replace the sensor without taking stuff apart and re soldering, which is a considerable advantage IMO

ryanp said:
Yeah i found that wiring info and messaged it to Reuben, the wires are soldered into the ECU and i have had the boss made. Just need to weld it in where the old IAT sensor goes, De-pin the IAT and wire the new sensor up.

Hopefully when it's done i'll have enough pics to make some sort of guide to help anyone else who carries this out!

I'd also like to see some pics of the method described by Jeff and Johan! sounds cleaner and easier in some respects.
 

kooyajerms

grocery getter
Joined
May 5, 2004
Location
Pomona, Southern California
TDI
97 B4V (mine), 11 x5 35d (hers) 04 V10 (that one you want), 2014 Q7 (mom's) 74 Shasta 1400
Here are the pictures and guide to installing the 3bar map sensor into a mk3 ecu


soldering points. front of ecu is where the plug is.


intake air temp sensor, cut and spliced into map sensor plug 1J0973704
look at those penclneck butt connectors =)


map sensor wires into map sensor plug. boss was from ebay for $20 and I jbwelded it. boost nipple is from ace hardware.
 

jsrmonster

Veteran Member - TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Apr 22, 2002
Location
Red Lion, PA
TDI
15 Golf SW DSG, RC3 piped, 99.5 Jetta Rocket PD150 6spd 4motion, 2000 ASV110 RC6 "Silverbullet" 5spd Race Car, 2003.5 Cummins QCLB 4x4 "Blue Monster" Jeep CRD juiced, MB Sprinter van juiced up
Looks good.

Here is how I made my first few 3bar sensor installations: (made swapping ecu's easier for R&D testing)




And this is what I am working on now, I found this 3bar motorola MPX sensor in the megasquirt box.

 

ryanp

Vendor
Joined
Jun 22, 2008
Location
Barnsley, South Yorkshire, UK
TDI
Arosa CR - 550hp - 9.7 @ 150mph 1/4 Mile, Citigo 4x4 CR TDi - 340hp, Caddy 2.0 CR 4x4 TDI - 300+hp, Golf Mk2 Van 1.9 TDI - was 290hp, Mk5 Ibiza 2.0 FR TDi - 270hp, BMW 135d - 360hp, BMW 330d - 335hp, BMW 335d - 380hp + a few more ........
I've done the same but with a 4 bar, cost me a fortune in the end so i wish i did what Jeff has done, would have been a third of the cost at the most!!

Ry
 

Rub87

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 10, 2006
Location
Belgium
TDI
Ibiza '99 90HP
first one is quite ugly, :p

just made ecu with sensor from vems, was 35€ or so, nice and small
 

kooyajerms

grocery getter
Joined
May 5, 2004
Location
Pomona, Southern California
TDI
97 B4V (mine), 11 x5 35d (hers) 04 V10 (that one you want), 2014 Q7 (mom's) 74 Shasta 1400
when you guys don't use the vw map sensors with the built in IAT, (Reuben), did you make a boss for a IAT sensor? I understand if I were ever to change to a 4bar (doubt it), the cheaper digikey sensors are the way to go, but then we are back to the old mk3 setup.

I like having it the way it is now though.
 

Rub87

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 10, 2006
Location
Belgium
TDI
Ibiza '99 90HP
didn't had the need, this car still uses stock pipe with IAT sensor.. if you have a good fmic you can just leave the IAT sensor out, it's of no use anyway exept for datalogging
 

kooyajerms

grocery getter
Joined
May 5, 2004
Location
Pomona, Southern California
TDI
97 B4V (mine), 11 x5 35d (hers) 04 V10 (that one you want), 2014 Q7 (mom's) 74 Shasta 1400
Good to know.

Traffic and sometimes hot weather will keep the IAT sensor connected. I'm more than happy that the timing gets retarded if necessary (It hasn't happened yet with the new FMIC).
 

Rub87

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 10, 2006
Location
Belgium
TDI
Ibiza '99 90HP
that tiny bit of NOx isn't going to make a difference ;)

Itsq not that you need to be scared for knock like you would do in a gasoline turbo engine =D
 

nutzu_gotgame

Active member
Joined
Sep 11, 2008
Location
Romania , GL
TDI
seat cordoba coupe 1.9TDI 110hp (ASV)
hello , i don't want to open other thread so i will post here :) .

i have some problems whit my 1.9tdi 110hp ASV .
it don't pulls as hard as he leaved the factory . now it moves like it has ~80-90hp .

i did a log whit vag com in the 2-3 gears whit the paddle to the flor :) and it shows a constant boost of allmoust 2 bar . it is ok ? it might be the boost(IAT) senzor broken ?

i also did a diagnoza , and it appeared a fault code at the air flow metter

1 Fault Found:
16485 - Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70): Implausible Signal
P0101 - 35-00 - -
Readiness: N/A

http://img94.imageshack.us/i/cordobacoupelog123blana.jpg/

here is the picture whit the log

thanks
 

ryanp

Vendor
Joined
Jun 22, 2008
Location
Barnsley, South Yorkshire, UK
TDI
Arosa CR - 550hp - 9.7 @ 150mph 1/4 Mile, Citigo 4x4 CR TDi - 340hp, Caddy 2.0 CR 4x4 TDI - 300+hp, Golf Mk2 Van 1.9 TDI - was 290hp, Mk5 Ibiza 2.0 FR TDi - 270hp, BMW 135d - 360hp, BMW 330d - 335hp, BMW 335d - 380hp + a few more ........
Stuck vanes due to a bad MAF which now gives low fuel, i had the same issue with no fault codes!!
 

nutzu_gotgame

Active member
Joined
Sep 11, 2008
Location
Romania , GL
TDI
seat cordoba coupe 1.9TDI 110hp (ASV)
thanks for answer ryanp . and how did you fix it ? what pieces should be changed ? in the future i want to clean the turbocharger , i guess that is the problem , but whit that log i saw that it delivers good boost so he might be ok ...
 

ryanp

Vendor
Joined
Jun 22, 2008
Location
Barnsley, South Yorkshire, UK
TDI
Arosa CR - 550hp - 9.7 @ 150mph 1/4 Mile, Citigo 4x4 CR TDi - 340hp, Caddy 2.0 CR 4x4 TDI - 300+hp, Golf Mk2 Van 1.9 TDI - was 290hp, Mk5 Ibiza 2.0 FR TDi - 270hp, BMW 135d - 360hp, BMW 330d - 335hp, BMW 335d - 380hp + a few more ........
when the vanes stick it's normally in overboost like you are getting, you need to remove the turbo and clean the VNT mechanism, there is a guide on here somewhere. I left it for too long and the exhaust wheel snapped a fin off due to overheating!! The MAf issue makes the fuelling poor so the high boost makes no difference to power. my ibiza must have had 60hp when it was like yours!!
 

nutzu_gotgame

Active member
Joined
Sep 11, 2008
Location
Romania , GL
TDI
seat cordoba coupe 1.9TDI 110hp (ASV)
ok , thanks mate ! i am driving it like this for a while , and pretty hard :) LOL i am surprised that it did not snapped so far . i will change the maf senzor ( air flow metter senzor ) and clen the turbocharger . thanks again . cheers
 
Last edited:

NB_TDi

Vendor
Joined
Mar 16, 2008
Location
NB, Canada █♣█
TDI
2014 Jetta SE
jsrmonster said:
Looks good.

Here is how I made my first few 3bar sensor installations: (made swapping ecu's easier for R&D testing)

And this is what I am working on now, I found this 3bar motorola MPX sensor in the megasquirt box.

Same sensor I'm using in my Digital Boost Gauge. Very robust, cheap and heck they work!
 

daffeduff

Member
Joined
May 26, 2013
Location
norway
TDI
1.9, passat b5 98
hi, i have a 97 passat b5 with the afn 110bhp non pd engine, i have the same ecu with map intergrated and was wondering if i could modify mine with a eksternal map sensor from a later model with the new ecu!? i have adjusted the actuator rod for more boost but get limp mode when i push through 3rd and 4th gear at 3500 rpm, will the 3bar map sensor mod fix this or is the problem something else? car is entirely stock
i don't have access to vagcom :(
 

drejck

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 17, 2010
Location
slovenija EU
TDI
golf3 1,9tdi 81kw
HI!
i have a problem,i have instaled 4 bar mapsensor,and wired it.i have no fault codes,but the sensor shows alvays 1158mb.so what is wrong?manual boost guage shows a lot of more presssuee depends of condition but even 2 bar,so what to do or check?
i also figured bad maf,what do you racomend original new,or from other car-dont know mk3 vr6,...mk4 r32...turbo is garett gtb1765...or when i will port the car to chiptuning remove it?
 
Top