287whp 2.0 TDI Jetta and still climbing...

mlemorie

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Aug 15, 2009
Location
Romulus Michigan
TDI
2004 Jetta
What software issues? As far as I know, it is just the 170hp versions of this engine which had a Siemens ECU that are more of a problem. This is just EDC16 (though a different variant from those in the US).
This is good to know! I was under the impression for some reason that all of the 16v engines were under siemens management. Madness is definately getting a 16v powerplant now. Just for my own curiousity now, what, if any, differences are there between the 140 BKD and the 170 (unknown code)? Gears are turning...
 

vwmikel

Vendor , w/Business number
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May 5, 2005
Location
Las Vegas, NV
TDI
'94 Golf Sport TDI
This is good to know! I was under the impression for some reason that all of the 16v engines were under siemens management. Madness is definately getting a 16v powerplant now. Just for my own curiousity now, what, if any, differences are there between the 140 BKD and the 170 (unknown code)? Gears are turning...
From memory, I do think it has different injectors and a DPF on the 170. The 140 doesn't have the DPF (or at least not most of them). Being that we kept Ryans car together with 300hp I don't think I'd worry too much about the strength of the engine for most builds. The internals may be different, but I doubt it's worth the trouble and if you're really going for some land speed records I would build the bottom end with some aftermarket rods anyway.
 

mlemorie

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Aug 15, 2009
Location
Romulus Michigan
TDI
2004 Jetta
Injectors were the main thing I was curious about. It should be fun either way in a sub 2000lb rwd hatch back lol. Must start saving.
 

unclesfunnyonions

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Joined
Jun 17, 2008
Location
Barnsley,South Yorkshire, England
TDI
Golf GT 170
From memory, I do think it has different injectors and a DPF on the 170. The 140 doesn't have the DPF (or at least not most of them). Being that we kept Ryans car together with 300hp I don't think I'd worry too much about the strength of the engine for most builds. The internals may be different, but I doubt it's worth the trouble and if you're really going for some land speed records I would build the bottom end with some aftermarket rods anyway.

The 170 engines have a cast alloy inlet manifold, 140 have a plastic.
Not sure if there's any internal difference tho, never removed mine....:confused:

Alex. :)
 

loudspl

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Apr 22, 2005
Location
Osakis, Minnesota
TDI
02 ASV w/ 02J
Are you also doing bigger valves on the ported BKD head?

Have you tried Firad 1043 +100%?

Congrats on the numbers. 16v FTW :)
 

ryanp

Vendor
Joined
Jun 22, 2008
Location
Barnsley, South Yorkshire, UK
TDI
Arosa CR - 550hp - 9.7 @ 150mph 1/4 Mile, Citigo 4x4 CR TDi - 340hp, Caddy 2.0 CR 4x4 TDI - 300+hp, Golf Mk2 Van 1.9 TDI - was 290hp, Mk5 Ibiza 2.0 FR TDi - 270hp, BMW 135d - 360hp, BMW 330d - 335hp, BMW 335d - 380hp + a few more ........
From memory, I do think it has different injectors and a DPF on the 170. The 140 doesn't have the DPF (or at least not most of them). Being that we kept Ryans car together with 300hp I don't think I'd worry too much about the strength of the engine for most builds. The internals may be different, but I doubt it's worth the trouble and if you're really going for some land speed records I would build the bottom end with some aftermarket rods anyway.
PD170 is Siemens Injection and Management. The Rods are stronger on the BMN PD170 compared to the BKD (The BKD has the same rods as the 105PS 1.9, the BMN has the same as the PD130/PD150) but these would be swapped with Rostens if we bent one. We keep trying but it won't die.

Injectors were the main thing I was curious about. It should be fun either way in a sub 2000lb rwd hatch back lol. Must start saving.
That would be good fun. Get saving and drop me an email ;)

Can the Mk5 be converted to AWD easier than a MK4? Ryan you should look into that...
:D

With all the parts at his disposal over there its a bolt in affair :mad:
:D

Ryan, do you know if your turbo kits will fit in a Ibiza 6J 2.0L FR TDI?
This is the CR engine right?? We are working on a CR Kit, but it is a minefield! I have your email, will reply soon

The 170 engines have a cast alloy inlet manifold, 140 have a plastic.
Not sure if there's any internal difference tho, never removed mine....:confused:

Alex. :)
Early BKDs had the Alloy Manifold, 06- had plastic. The PD170 have a plastic one with flaps controlled by a vacuum actuator. There are other differences I mentioned before

Are you also doing bigger valves on the ported BKD head?

Have you tried Firad 1043 +100%?

Congrats on the numbers. 16v FTW :)
There is not much space on the 16v head to put bigger valves, the head guys I have worked with both think it is a lot of work and expense for little gain. A good porting job would suffice. Remember these figures are BEFORE the ported head, which is why we rekon most people will take it to this level and stick to that.

Do you have the Firad number for these Nozzles? They sound like the 8v to me, 16v nozzles are different and the largest we could find we Bosio R1287+. We have some custom ones on the way. Can't wait for them to arrive.

Thanks for the kind words everyone, I hope to have some good progress over the next month or 2.

Ry

RudolfDiesel - I will get you the logs you want to see when I get the car back, hopefully you are impressed :) Remind me in a few weeks, I am liable to forget :rolleyes:
 

mlemorie

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Joined
Aug 15, 2009
Location
Romulus Michigan
TDI
2004 Jetta
Just for my own curiousity. In the CR engine SSP, VW talked about recessing the valves into the head and going with flat top pistons as opposed to the projected valves and recessed pistons of the BKD for better "swirl preservation". What kind of power benefit would that be. I know better swirl=better mixture=better/cleaner bang, but from a modification standpoint, would recessing the valves and switching pistons offer up much for gains? Not only for this engine, I have been wondering about that for the 8v engines as well. Not that I mean throw CJAA pistons into a BEW, but having a flat top piston without valve pockets. It would seem that the BEW head would be a bit more accepting of this as it already has recessed valves. Or am I just getting into something worth way less than the effort? lol. Sorry for the off topic.
 
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Alcaid

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Sep 5, 2006
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Norway
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See signature
Impressed that the rods aren't banana shaped or broken by now! Keep up the beating Ryan and let us know if/when they give in :)
 

unclesfunnyonions

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2008
Location
Barnsley,South Yorkshire, England
TDI
Golf GT 170
Early BKDs had the Alloy Manifold, 06- had plastic. The PD170 have a plastic one with flaps controlled by a vacuum actuator. There are other differences I mentioned before
Riiiiight, so should i have a plastic instead of alloy or is it just model/year (mines a 56 reg) dependent? What year did it change to alloy on BMN? Confused me a bit with that one. :)

Just worried 'cos when it was in for the clutch you told me it might have done more miles than it says on the clock, can't trust anyone these days.....(not you Ry)

Anyway, is there any gains to be had in smoothing, port matching etc?

Alex. :)
 

ryanp

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Jun 22, 2008
Location
Barnsley, South Yorkshire, UK
TDI
Arosa CR - 550hp - 9.7 @ 150mph 1/4 Mile, Citigo 4x4 CR TDi - 340hp, Caddy 2.0 CR 4x4 TDI - 300+hp, Golf Mk2 Van 1.9 TDI - was 290hp, Mk5 Ibiza 2.0 FR TDi - 270hp, BMW 135d - 360hp, BMW 330d - 335hp, BMW 335d - 380hp + a few more ........
Just for my own curiousity. In the CR engine SSP, VW talked about recessing the valves into the head and going with flat top pistons as opposed to the projected valves and recessed pistons of the BKD for better "swirl preservation". What kind of power benefit would that be. I know better swirl=better mixture=better/cleaner bang, but from a modification standpoint, would recessing the valves and switching pistons offer up much for gains? Not only for this engine, I have been wondering about that for the 8v engines as well. Not that I mean throw CJAA pistons into a BEW, but having a flat top piston without valve pockets. It would seem that the BEW head would be a bit more accepting of this as it already has recessed valves. Or am I just getting into something worth way less than the effort? lol. Sorry for the off topic.
I will let someone with a bigger brain than me elaborate on that one :)

Damn, there is no prize for second fastest diesel at GTI Spring Festival! :D
Who says you'll be second Jason :p
I was 2nd fastest last year so who says any of us will be this year?

Impressed that the rods aren't banana shaped or broken by now! Keep up the beating Ryan and let us know if/when they give in :)
We keep trying to bend them but it is not happening!

Riiiiight, so should i have a plastic instead of alloy or is it just model/year (mines a 56 reg) dependent? What year did it change to alloy on BMN? Confused me a bit with that one. :)

Just worried 'cos when it was in for the clutch you told me it might have done more miles than it says on the clock, can't trust anyone these days.....(not you Ry)

Anyway, is there any gains to be had in smoothing, port matching etc?

Alex. :)
Yours is plastic isn't it? Didn't take much notice TBH.

I can't see any benefit to port matching the manifold on the 2.0 16vs, it has a split port design so I would say it would cause more harm than good messing with them. On the PD170 you just have to make sure the flaps are actually working. Those little actuators are very flimsy!

Ry
 

unclesfunnyonions

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Jun 17, 2008
Location
Barnsley,South Yorkshire, England
TDI
Golf GT 170
Yours is plastic isn't it? Didn't take much notice TBH.

I can't see any benefit to port matching the manifold on the 2.0 16vs, it has a split port design so I would say it would cause more harm than good messing with them. On the PD170 you just have to make sure the flaps are actually working. Those little actuators are very flimsy!
No mines cast!

Split port, is that sort of like siamese ports on classic mini heads?

Just been out for a nosey (for my own sanity) under the bonnet, the manifold sorta looks like a small plenum arrangement, air into a chamber at the top then 8 runners into the head. Also Definatley cast alloy.

Alex. :)
 

Tom.

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Oct 21, 2010
Location
Doncaster UK
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SEAT Ibiza PD130
I was 2nd fastest last year so who says any of us will be this year?
I'd say theres only one other likely competitor for winning it, and thats the guy with the mk2. So if he wins, that would leave one of us second. Not that I aint gonna try beat him :D
 

Rub87

Top Post Dawg
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Dec 10, 2006
Location
Belgium
TDI
Ibiza '99 90HP
Ryan, what about this 8V PD cams with steeper inj lobe? I need one by summer.. :D
 

eddie_1

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Joined
Dec 27, 2004
Location
Hannover, Germany formerly Toronto & NY
TDI
Jetta Wagon 2003 TDI tuned to 170HP, A6 Wagon 2008 TDI 2.7L tuned to 340HP
Congrats Ryan! Maybe next time I can get a ride. :) The clutch you gave me is holding up just like your BKD. Thanks. Looks like you got everything well optimized.
 

ryanp

Vendor
Joined
Jun 22, 2008
Location
Barnsley, South Yorkshire, UK
TDI
Arosa CR - 550hp - 9.7 @ 150mph 1/4 Mile, Citigo 4x4 CR TDi - 340hp, Caddy 2.0 CR 4x4 TDI - 300+hp, Golf Mk2 Van 1.9 TDI - was 290hp, Mk5 Ibiza 2.0 FR TDi - 270hp, BMW 135d - 360hp, BMW 330d - 335hp, BMW 335d - 380hp + a few more ........
No logs or Cams as of yet, too busy for my own good!!

Wont be testing a Portugese file out any time soon! I'm gutted you didn't get chance to have a go in it, there will be a next time I'm sure!

Speak soon

Ry
 
Joined
Oct 22, 2009
Location
england
TDI
to many
had test in ryans car this week ive owned and drove a lot of tuned motors ive owned 500 + gassers so not easily impressed very gud all round performance 70 to 150 staggerring real road performance
 

NoJoke

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Joined
Apr 11, 2003
Very well done!!! Looking at the stock vs. modded dyno chart I was wondering when those twin turbo's are going in:D?
 

ryanp

Vendor
Joined
Jun 22, 2008
Location
Barnsley, South Yorkshire, UK
TDI
Arosa CR - 550hp - 9.7 @ 150mph 1/4 Mile, Citigo 4x4 CR TDi - 340hp, Caddy 2.0 CR 4x4 TDI - 300+hp, Golf Mk2 Van 1.9 TDI - was 290hp, Mk5 Ibiza 2.0 FR TDi - 270hp, BMW 135d - 360hp, BMW 330d - 335hp, BMW 335d - 380hp + a few more ........
Haha, ill leave the compound turbos for my drag car and the CR engines we are working on!

I need to speak to you about some stuff when i get time!!
 
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