Tata Pixel with 1.2 Liter TDI

VWannabe

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That looks pretty nice. Lightweight, cheap, engine in the back. Like the original Beetle. I wonder how the reliability would be. Also have to pass emissions and DOT, not an easy task.
 

K.I.T.T.

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Is that 1.2 powerplant a VAG unit? A 1.2l 3 pot (derived from the 1.6 CR TDI) is used in the new Polo.

Ash :)
 

bhtooefr

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I'm not seeing anything to indicate that it's a VAG engine.

I will note that the Nano is rumored to get a 600-800 cc twin, designed specifically for it. This could be a 3-cylinder version of that, if the 2-cylinder is 800 cc.
 

K.I.T.T.

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Like I said, my 2p :)

But why do you say that? Because of its price vs the Tata?

Is the Smart quite expensive in the US? How much would a new base Golf TDI and Mini Cooper cost over there? Puchase price parity and all that, so I can't really make judgements on price in $ alone.

They're actually not that popular over here. I'd take a Polo over a Smart any day. Too big? Give me an old Lupo TDI.

Ash :)
 

bhtooefr

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A Golf TDI would be $23k, a Mini Cooper would be in the same ballpark, IIRC.

But, a Smart is usually compared to a Kia Rio, Hyundai Accent, Kia Rio, Ford Fiesta, Honda Fit (Jazz), Toyota Yaris, etc., etc.

And, those are all about the same price as a base Smart, often better equipped than a base Smart, bigger, and get the same fuel economy.
 

K.I.T.T.

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Do you get cars like the Toyota Aygo (smaller than a Yaris) and Toyota IQ (smaller still) over there? I'd have thought the Smart would be competing with those as opposed to Fiestas, etc.

I'd consdier the Lupo to compete with the Smart as well...until VW binned it and gave us the horrible Fox. Can we have the Lupo back? Pretty please, with a cherry on top?

Ash :)
 

bhtooefr

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We're just now getting the iQ.

Keep in mind that in most of the US, parking is a complete non-issue. That and fashion are the two reasons to buy a Smart, given that the Smart costs as much as bigger cars, and gets the same fuel economy. And, fashion isn't selling them, here. (And, the Mini Cooper (another small car that's relying on fashion) is great to drive, the Smart is awful to drive. At least Priuses get reasonable fuel economy for their size, the Smart doesn't, so it doesn't even have green credentials, to get fashion sales that way.)

My dad bought a Smart because he needed a $13k or less car that got 40 mpg, was tall (for easier ingress and egress), and had an automatic, and he wanted a warranty. The Smart was, technically, the only car that met those requirements - but had he dropped the tall requirement, there would've been other options that were far more practical, and better cars, with far better dealer networks.
 
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K.I.T.T.

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Okay. I can understand getting a Smart if you want a small, cheap(ish) car that gives decent fuel economy, but once you start speccing them up to $22k+, I think you start to lose the plot.

At that money, I'd have a Cooper any day. They're not particularly bad on fuel either for a petrol engine.

Hope you guys get more small car and diesel options in the future. We even get a Cooper D over here!

Parking over here can be an issue in cities...I'm a poor student and couldn't afford the insurance on (specced up) Golf and a Lupo was too small for my needs, hence the Polo. They rape you for insurance if your a young driver here, was paying £2.2k when I first got my car at 19. A Golf would have been £3k...

Even without the Parking issue, there must be a market for a small diesel in the US that car makers just haven't tapped into yet. It appears the average commute over there is significantly longer than that in the UK. I'd rather drive a Polo diesel to and from work than a V8 pickup, especially with the current price of fuel.

Ash :)
 
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Diesel_Benz

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The smart is on its own. There is no vehicle in the US market that competes with it in size, but as said before, there are significantly larger cars that get the same fuel economy (36mpg). In the US its primarily a fashion or statement piece since congestion is nowhere near the problem it is in Europe.
 

john.jackson9213

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My better half was intersted in a Mini for more than a year before we drove one. She is 5' 2" and the head rest was at an uncomfortable angle for her. It was fine for me (5"9"). But the headrest was a deal breaker for her. The Mini is not all that great on MPG, not bad either.

Currently looking at a Kia Optima $22K, 35mpg hwy rating. Hard to beat value.


Okay. I can understand getting a Smart if you want a small, cheap(ish) car that gives decent fuel economy, but once you start speccing them up to $22k+, I think you start to lose the plot.

At that money, I'd have a Cooper any day. They're not particularly bad on fuel either for a petrol engine.

Hope you guys get more small car and diesel options in the future. We even get a Cooper D over here!

Parking over here can be an issue in cities...I'm a poor student and couldn't afford the insurance on (specced up) Golf and a Lupo was too small for my needs, hence the Polo. They rape you for insurance if your a young driver here, was paying £2.2k when I first got my car at 19. A Golf would have been £3k...

Even without the Parking issue, there must be a market for a small diesel in the US that car makers just haven't tapped into yet. It appears the average commute over there is significantly longer than that in the UK. I'd rather drive a Polo diesel to and from work than a V8 pickup, especially with the current price of fuel.

Ash :)
 

Diesel_Benz

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Even without the Parking issue, there must be a market for a small diesel in the US that car makers just haven't tapped into yet.
There is a HUGE market for them. VW, MB and BMW sell every one they import and diesels are what makes Ford/Dodge/GM pickup viable for small businesses and farmers/ranchers to tow with.

The problem is California/CARB/EPA, GM and pickups. GM murdered Diesel's reputation in the US in the 70's and 80's, smoke belching modified pickups aren't helping that reputation and California/CARB/EPA does everything it can to basically outlaw them by setting impractical for manufacturers to meet emissions standards and making it very expensive to get them certified.
 
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bhtooefr

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I think the cheapest a diesel car can be sold for, now, is about $20k, due to all the emissions equipment.

And, that emissions equipment is killing fuel economy ratings - many diesel engines won't be able to beat the gasoline engines on the EPA test cycle, despite getting far better economy on the NEDC cycle.
 
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