new turbo gauge installed

stronzo

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Location
canada
TDI
2004 golf tdi
Hey guys I got my new turbo boost gauge installed yesterday. most people didn't want to install it for me because they weren't sure where to tap into.

So I found this performance shop that deals with installing gauges, but the guy could not get the gauge to work. I notice he was trying many different ways to hook up the tubing. Right behind the turbo where the little rubber hoses are, thats where he was trying to get the pressure from by the looks of things.

But he finally got feat up & said this way will work for sure, so what I notice next what he did is he drilled A hole on the plastic pipe that goes from the inter cooler to the turbo & thats where he tapped into to get the pressure.

So it works, but I'll get some pictures today to post & if someone can tell me if this is A proper way of doing things.

I just got little concerns of A slight buzzing or kind of like vibrating sound from the gauge when the boost kicks in is this normal for gauges to do that.

now the other thing is my boost pressure seem to be accurate like the guy said when they did my relash

I'm sustaining 17-18PSI with A 22PSI spike but what I realized is if I'm cruising 80km/h or so in 4th gear, & then step on the gas my spike goes to 29PSI is that NORMAL
 

tmophoto

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Apr 14, 2007
Location
aspen colorado
TDI
2002 jetta silver arrow GLS TDI
I am not sure about the pressures but the buzzing is normal for a mechanical gauge. the electronic gauges dont have that (no tubing running into the car).
did that guy take the intercooler pipe off before he drilled it? that is a good place to put the fitting but you really shoudl take the ic pipe out of the car and clean it out after drilling so the plastic shavings from the drill dont get sucked into the engine.
i just installed one last week and put it on the plastic pipe from the intercooler to the intake.
you might want to put in a boost valve to limit the peaks. they are really cheap and very easy to install boostvalve

t
 

Satiro

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2006
Location
Spain
TDI
IBIZA 1.9TDI 110hp AFN 1998
tmophoto said:
I am not sure about the pressures but the buzzing is normal for a mechanical gauge. the electronic gauges dont have that (no tubing running into the car).
did that guy take the intercooler pipe off before he drilled it? that is a good place to put the fitting but you really shoudl take the ic pipe out of the car and clean it out after drilling so the plastic shavings from the drill dont get sucked into the engine.
i just installed one last week and put it on the plastic pipe from the intercooler to the intake.
you might want to put in a boost valve to limit the peaks. they are really cheap and very easy to install boostvalve

t
My boostgauge has a tubing running into the car but never buzz, at any boost. Is made for HP-Raid... ;)
 

stronzo

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Location
canada
TDI
2004 golf tdi
RE: tmophoto

Yes the tubbing goes through the car & did disconnect the inter cooler pipe when he drilled through . & cleaned

But is it really worth it for the boost valves:confused:

I'll get some pictures A bit later of the installation & gauge

& for the buzzing sound it's not overly that loud at all:) & it is an isspro gauge

I hope it's good enough quality:eek:
 

sportsguy

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Mar 11, 2005
Location
Seattle-ish
TDI
2014 Beetle DSG TDI
Actually, this is common - lots of folks tap into the intercooler pipe to get the pressure for the gauge.

As for the buzzing, lots of people report that with some mechanical gauges.

As for the boost spikes, others will need to chime in on that.
 

dieseleux

Théoricien -TDIClub Contributor
Joined
Nov 14, 2006
Location
Pas assez loin pour vider ma tank!
TDI
Jetta TDI 02
I make a retriction with a WD40 red tube at the connection with intake tube.
Gauge is more smooth and no or very little buzz sound.
If buzz is still to big with red tube, install a small (very small) air tanks (ex.:gaz filter) or more longer tube to gauge.


Dieseleux
 

Fourdiesel

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May 19, 2003
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SW Wash. USA
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'04 Touareg V10 TDI
"Buzzing" or vibration of the needle is common with Isspro pressure gages. A small enough restriction in the pressure line will eliminate this. I had an Isspro gage on my '83 Mitsu Turbodiesel PU that 'buzzed' until the needle fell off the gage! The buzzing is caused by pressure waves generated by the intake valves closing. If the pressure tap is as far away as possible from the valves (think at the turbo outlet) the fluctuations are at the minimum. If that's not enough - or is too hard to do, a restrictor or dampener must be used. Some other brands of gages have built in restrictors.
 

stronzo

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Location
canada
TDI
2004 golf tdi
Boost valve

our A boost valve really necessary if you have too much spike, my car sometimes spikes in every gear to 25PSI to 29PSI:eek:

But if I had A boost valve whats the real benefit, will it make the car run better at lower speed meaning more torque.

Or is it just A waist of money. I'd like more opinion before I buy one if theres any benefits:)
 

2footbraker

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 6, 2005
Location
Ontario, Canada
TDI
06 Jetta, 01 Golf
It will preserve your turbo. It will also prevent going into limp mode if your spikes get really high. If your car is stock than boost spikes that high are not normal and your vanes (assuming you have a VNT) may be sticking. You may also have a vacuum leak near your N75 or the N75 is failing.
 

stronzo

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Location
canada
TDI
2004 golf tdi
RE:2footbraker

Preserving the turbo sounds good :) what does it mean when the car goes into limp mode:eek:

My car is A 2004 golf Tdi-Pd & I'm assuming it came with the stock vnt-15
is this correct ,can you confirm this :eek:

when you say something about turbo sticking whats going to stick heres A picture of my turbo, do you mean that flap that you see there will stick.

Can any one tell me if this is A healthy turbo inside VW dealer says needs Attention
http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa4/Giacomo_bucket/Image014.jpg:confused:
 

Ed's TDI

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 30, 2001
Location
Victoria, BC, Canada
TDI
2001 Bora and 2016 Touareg
Limp mode is when the ECU sees much higher levels of boost than it's requesting and it basically retards boost and fuel to save the engine/turbo form self destruction. You'll notice it when the car goes into safe mode because it will run, but it'll feel like there's no power. Turning the key off then on again will reset it.

Your '04 PD uses a KP39 turbo, not a vnt15 like the ALH or non-PD TDI's prior to '04. Spikes up to 26+ psi are not good on any stock turbo and your chip-tuner should be made aware of the situation and should be able to correct it.

Regarding the turbo vanes sticking, our turbos have moveable vanes that the ECU adjusts the angle of in order to spool the turbo up quicker form lower rpms and to keep the are flowing at higher rpms. It's almost like having 2 turbos, a smaller faster spooling one to get off the line and a larger one for high rpm driving. Sometimes these vanes get stuck and don't adjust which can cause boost variations or spikes.

A boost valve is a check valve that, once installed, allows you to adjust and set how much boost will be allowed before the valve will open and release excessive boost. It is good fail-safe measure but again your chip-tuner should be able to fix the problem.

One thing a boost valve is beneficial for is it keeps boost levels from dropping off drastically after a spike. The ECU sees boost spikes and pullsback boost/fuel to counter the spike, which lessens your car's performance becuase it then has to build up boost again. A boost valve allows boost levels to remain constant because it eliminates spikes so the ECU doesn't pull back power.
 

stronzo

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Location
canada
TDI
2004 golf tdi
RE: ed'sTDI

Thanks ED your A great teacher:D did you see the picture of my turbo , is that the vanes of the turbo that moves you see in my picture.

The other thing is when you say the car something about the doesn't run as good when the spikes are high.

My worry is that my spikes jump to 29PSI but my performance is awesome .:)
but sometimes a good thing could be A bad thing right!!

And the only down fall to my performance it feels like sometimes the turbo takes time to spool up to go in first gear but once it gets going it's good.

But I wander if the boost valve will correct my problem on take off:rolleyes: & do you know if I can order A boost valve in CANADA somewhere:)

Thanks ED!
 

Ed's TDI

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 30, 2001
Location
Victoria, BC, Canada
TDI
2001 Bora and 2016 Touareg
As I said, I'd talk with whoever did your chip-tuning first and ee if they can resolve your issue with the boost spikes before I go and buy a boost valve. If that doesn't work, you can go directly to the boost valve website and order. He ships to Canada and there's no problem receiving the package through Customs. I bought one a while ago and never used it so I sold it a few months back.
 

2footbraker

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 6, 2005
Location
Ontario, Canada
TDI
06 Jetta, 01 Golf
That picture is not your vanes or anything to do with your turbo. That is the anti-shudder valve. If your turbo is a waste-gate turbo it does not have vanes. It would have a simple waste-gate. Both a VNT and a waste-gate turbo are controlled by an actuator. Are you chipped? If you are than that is probably the source of your boost spikes and you either need to get that addressed by the chip vendor or just get a boost valve.

If you are not chipped then there is something wrong with your waste-gate or actuator.
 

stronzo

Veteran Member
Joined
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Location
canada
TDI
2004 golf tdi
RE:Ed

Ok I'll go back where I got the remap done & see what they can do :mad:

So what would be the maximum safest boost spike for the KP39:confused:

now I hitting boost spike to 30PSI :eek: maybe more but my gauge only goes to 30PSI
 

stronzo

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Location
canada
TDI
2004 golf tdi
RE:footbraker

I'm no mechanic or anything but from what ED told me is that for my 2004 golf TDi-PD my turbo is A KP39

Yes I'm chipped:) & At the maximum for the stock & for the safest.

But I guess it 's not safe if your spiking 30PSI :(
 

otbBlaine

Veteran Member
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Feb 2, 2006
Location
Orange County, Ca
TDI
2002 Golf
30 psi = bad things.

Get a boost valve to cut this down, and ecstuning.com has an anti-buzz T fitting you can get to cut out the gauge buzz.

ES#2989 is the SKU, it's like $6 US.
 

johnnloki

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2007
Location
bowmanville ON
TDI
04 Golf TDI
Boost valves are good- it'll preserve your turbo and preserve your performance without any crazy yo yoing of your requested boost levels. If you're chipped, the vendor didn't do a very good job- he definitely didn't give you a chip that'll deliver the most performance safely, he delivered a chip that'll give you a paperweight that looks like a turbo. I'd be thinking refund, myself, if he's not willing/able to fix the problem that his software is likely causing.

If you want safe performance, boostvalve though, all the way. Have the software tuned to request 18-18.5psi, and the boostvalve to open at 20. That's the most power you can get from your turbo, and the safest way to get it.
 

stronzo

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Location
canada
TDI
2004 golf tdi
Thanks guys for your opinions

I just tested the car again on hwy & city I'm sustaining 17-18 PSI & spike at 22PSI

I only notice like I said before if I'm cruising 3rd 4th 0r 5th & then step on the gas depends what cruising speed I'm going It sometimes spikes at 29-30 PSI then sustains at 17-18PSI

I could control this if I dont press the gas all the way down ,but that takes the fun away sometimes :)
 

Suns_PSD

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Feb 20, 2007
Location
Austin, TX
TDI
none
Would you guys recommend tapping into the intercooler pipes before or after the intercooler?

What is the reasoning behind this?
 

Satiro

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 3, 2006
Location
Spain
TDI
IBIZA 1.9TDI 110hp AFN 1998
Suns_PSD said:
Would you guys recommend tapping into the intercooler pipes before or after the intercooler?

What is the reasoning behind this?
for the boostgauge tap in the upper IC pipe, nearest of intake manifold...this give you the most reliable measurement of boost in the intake manifold...
For boostvalve tap in the lower IC pipe, nearest to the turbocharger...this give you the fastest response to fix the overboost.. sorry by my english friend, GOOD LUCK!:)
 

stronzo

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Location
canada
TDI
2004 golf tdi
RE: othBlaine

otbBlaine said:
30 psi = bad things.

Get a boost valve to cut this down, and ecstuning.com has an anti-buzz T fitting you can get to cut out the gauge buzz.

ES#2989 is the SKU, it's like $6 US.

I have A isspro gauge, would this anti-buzz T fitting work for any gauges.
I ask this because ecstuning wasn't for sure if it would cut out the buzz on my gauge , but they know it works for the VDO gages.

I just got off the phone with PDR who I bought my gauge from he said that buzzing sound is something to do with my turbo with the vans in the turbo not working or getting stuck or something like that what he said. could this be true too for the buzzing sound or did I get fed the big BS:eek:

He also said that he had A customer that had the same relating problems with the buzzing sound & they tried many different brands of gauges & still buzzing. where they tried same gauges on another same vehicle & no buzzing. So he says it's my turbo making that noise :(:mad::eek::confused:
 

brew1

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Dec 18, 2004
Location
Richfield WI
TDI
15 GSW SEL TDI
Ed brings up a good point regarding your chip tuner being able to control boost with his programming.

Who provided your ECU tune?
 
Last edited:

EddyKilowatt

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Joined
Mar 1, 2006
Location
Carmel Valley CA
TDI
2003 Golf GL 5M
Suns_PSD said:
Would you guys recommend tapping into the intercooler pipes before or after the intercooler?

What is the reasoning behind this?
It depends on why you are measuring boost.

If you are measuring boost for the purpuse of not overworking your turbo, I would recommend BEFORE the intercooler... between the compressor outlet and the intercooler inlet. This is the pressure reading that best reflects the stress on the turbo. It also has the benefit of being much farther away from the intake valves and the noisy pressure waves that they generate.

OTOH, if you are the ECU, or a chip tuner, then maybe you monitor after the IC... that's the air-density measurement that you need properly fuel the engine.

In practice, there probably isn't much pressure drop across the intercooler, so I reckon you can monitor on either side of it and get almost the same number.

Eddy
 

stronzo

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 14, 2007
Location
canada
TDI
2004 golf tdi
Could the boost spike be driving style sometimes ?

brew1 said:
Ed brings up a good point regarding your chip tuner being able to control boost with his programming.

Who provided your ECU tune?

I'm bringing it back tomorrow for A re tune , but I told buddy that it only spikes when I'm in 4th ,5th or 3rd gear at low or cruising speed & then suddenly step on the gas & 29 to 30 PSI spikes. He says the high spike like that is due to when I'm cursing on low speed & I'm in A low gear like 4th or 5th & so on , so the turbo spools up in such At low speed ,in such a low gear that thats what happens.

But if my revs are kept normal that match the speed that I'm going when I just want to step on the gas & go where the car doesn't have to catch up speed there no spike at all ,

Have you or any of yous noticed this with the reading of your boost spike when you drive this way. When you drive lazy in A low gear & don't bother to down shift & just step on it & then it spikes , to higher then usual readings.

Could this just be A driving style that it spikes . To any of you with the boost gauge try the ABOVE every once in A while & see if you SPIKE more then you should:)
 
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