ALH whining noise, sounds like a bad power steering pump

i_dont_golf

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 23, 2008
Location
san diego, ca
TDI
2000 golf tdi gls
hey there everyone! i did a search, couldn't find what i was looking for exactly. maybe this has been discussed but too much random BS comes up with search results and i don't have time to sit for hours and search through thread after thread. but anyway, on to my question.

i had my timing belt changed at a reputable shop my family has been going to for years, hugo's european car service in encinitas, CA. they told me they have lots of experience with TDI's and have done many TB jobs, they used new style rollers and put in a new water pump, new engine mount bolts, etc. The job was done about 3 months/12k miles ago and everything seemed totally fine until last monday. a loud whining noise that sounds exaclty like a PS pump low on fluid developed in the TB area. it increases with acceleration. i took it back to the shop to see if they could get to the bottom of it. they took of the serp. belt and the noise remained, so they checked the belt tension and all of the rollers and everything else and said everything was 100%. the noise isn't going away, obviously, and they said nothing seemed out of the ordinary and i won't need to worry about anything falling off or breaking.

anyone have experience with a similar issue? i'm worried it may be my oil pump, tranny fluid pump, or ???? since i've had it (8 months, 30k miles) i've only used 5w40 synthetic, with the exception of the last change being M1 0w40. i also don't notice any drag, power loss or fuel mileage decrease after it started.

thanks!

also, if it matters, i changed the fluid (used the factory stuff) in the 01m @ 73k miles shortly before the TB job, it now has 87k miles. and the PS pump is NOT the source of the noise, even though it sounds like it ;) if that matters. and VAG-COM shows nothing out of the ordinary.
 
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i_dont_golf

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Jul 23, 2008
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san diego, ca
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2000 golf tdi gls
i thought i put it in there, oops. 2000 golf auto trans. 88k miles (not 87k like i originally said, huge difference :D)
 

vwjettadsl

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Feb 24, 2005
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Missouri
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TDI’s
Can you tell what general area the noise is coming from? i.e. passenger side, driver's side
 

i_dont_golf

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Jul 23, 2008
Location
san diego, ca
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2000 golf tdi gls
it says in my first post its coming from the timing belt/serpentine belt area which would be passenger side. still driving the car, and still notice no difference in how it drives, but i want to be safe here and not let anything go too long to the point of breaking
 

greengeeker

Vendor
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Feb 8, 2006
Location
Cambridge, MN
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2002 Jetta GLS
i_dont_golf said:
the noise isn't going away, obviously, and they said nothing seemed out of the ordinary and i won't need to worry about anything falling off or breaking.
BS meter going off. I'd get it to a tdiclub guru in your area to get a second, more informed opinion. Do you happen to know what water pump they put in there?
 

vwjettadsl

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Location
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TDI’s
i_dont_golf said:
it says in my first post its coming from the timing belt/serpentine belt area which would be passenger side. still driving the car, and still notice no difference in how it drives, but i want to be safe here and not let anything go too long to the point of breaking
Well my thoughts are that is possible that the shop that did the work did not use top quality parts. Just because a shop uses parts with the proper part numbers doesn't mean that the parts aren't junk. He could have bought some cheap chinese parts off of eBay for all you know.

I had one customer bring a car to me after he purchased it complaning that there was a noise coming from the TB area, but that the TB, rollers, tensioner and water pump had been replaced just before he bought the car 5,000 miles previously. The noise was much like yours, it increased with the rpm's of the engine. I ended up taking off each roller from the timing belt job to find the culprit and discovered that the bearings for the large idler roller were going out. You could see the grease from the roller all over the side of it. Turns out it was a Meyle brand roller, also the water pump was leaking, it too was a Meyle brand.

Whenever I do a timing belt job I always use Ina rollers and a Graf or Hepu waterpump.

So my suggestion is to find out what brand of parts the shop used. If they didn't use Ina rollers then I would have them replaced.

Well thats my $.02
 

i_dont_golf

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san diego, ca
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2000 golf tdi gls
the water pump is graf and the rollers are Ina, high quality german stuff. they have a stock of all the parts needed at the shop, and he showed me the boxes of the parts used after the job was done. i drive by the shop on hwy 101 all the time and i've seen multiple TDIs there. not at the same time, but i know i have seen more than one, and the guys are very honest and very good at what they do. plus, the job was done more than 12k miles ago. if they had really screwed up i doubt it would take this long for a problem to arise unless the tension is too tight, and they said they checked it and it was fine, and offered to fix anything for free that they found even though i'm just out of warranty (12k/3month warranty on any work performed there). plus it sounds like an overworked PS pump. if there is a tdi 'guru' in the greater san diego area and won't charge me an arm and a leg to look at my car i'll contact one.
 

i_dont_golf

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Jul 23, 2008
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san diego, ca
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2000 golf tdi gls
yeah, it's full, fluid looks brand new, and when i turn the wheel there are no unusual noises and the specific noise i am hearing does not get louder. that was the first thing i checked.
 

WPB TDI FRED

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Mar 2, 2006
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SOUTH FLORIDA
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03 JETTA - Stick
Any additional posts, follow-ups, diagnosis, or troubleshooting tips on the above problem by the non-golfer???

Was the problem solved??

Very interested to know if the issue was resolved......seems like the same problem developed here last Sunday on the way back home from a road trip. Topped off with very offensively expensive designer power steering fluid, courtesy of VW, without resolving the problem.
 

Ski in NC

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Jul 7, 2008
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Wilmington, NC USA
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2001 Jetta ALH 5sp stock
Even good quality rollers and water pumps can randomly fail. I would have the shop tear down the timing belt hardware and inspect. I bet they will find a failed part. Catch it early before it eats your engine.
 

i_dont_golf

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Jul 23, 2008
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san diego, ca
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2000 golf tdi gls
well, here is an update. yesterday a NEW noise developed. along with the power steering like whine when i drive, a 'rubbing' type noise is also coming from the TB area. ***? it's loud and only audible at idle but it really concerns me. it's sounds like the belt is rubbing on someting so i took it to the shop immediately when i noticed it and they inspected it for a bit and said they couldnt find anything wrong, AT ALL! it might be internal, sounds like it may even be coming fom the camshaft. i guess the TB tensioner is auto-tensioned, so they couldnt over tension it, correct? i was worried about the belt being overtightened and ruining bearings, etc. BUT they told me that if anything that has to do with the timing belt AT ALL fails regardless of mileage and the head/engine is ruined they would cover the entire thing, engine and all. he told me he'd rather me keep driving it and see if it changes before he tears it apart, probably since i'm not going to be paying for it. i need a tdi guru. even though this shop told me they're experienced with TDI's and i've seen TDI's there i wold rather not trust my car to them for major engine maintainance any more. anyone know a TDI guru in SD county, or near me? or at last a shop that i can trust with my TDI?
 
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i_dont_golf

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san diego, ca
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2000 golf tdi gls
it turns out the shop i took it to overtightened the timing belt tensioner, re-used the stretch bolts on the motor mount but only put ONE back in, one was less than finger tight and the other was sitting on the frame rail. that could have been catastrophic. the timing was off, too. now it's done right thanks to scott @ biochoppers, and the shop said they would cover the cost of parts for the new TB kit. so they originally charged me $995 for the job, and i'm getting about $400 or less back. he refused to admit his mechanics effed everything up, except the bolt issue. the fact that they didn't find any of these problems when they "looked at the car" when i brought it back TWO different times pisses me off. what a lame shop, i should call the BAR.
 
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whiterayven

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Mar 28, 2008
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Vancouver
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99.5 Jetta TDI
i_dont_golf said:
it turns out the shop i took it to overtightened the timing belt tensioner, re-used the stretch bolts on the motor mount but only put ONE back in, one was less than finger tight and the other was sitting on the frame rail. that could have been catastrophic. the timing was off, too. now it's done right thanks to scott @ biochoppers, and the shop said they would cover the cost of parts for the new TB kit. so they originally charged me $995 for the job, and i'm getting about $400 or less back. he refused to admit his mechanics effed everything up, except the bolt issue. the fact that they didn't find any of these problems when they "looked at the car" when i brought it back TWO different times pisses me off. what a lame shop, i should call the BAR.
I guess the lesson learned here is that no matter how much you trust your shop, it's always a good idea to get a second opinion when things don't add up.
 

i_dont_golf

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Jul 23, 2008
Location
san diego, ca
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2000 golf tdi gls
this is very true. the shop has always done very good work and they're not con artists by any means, and my family has gone to them for about 15 years. the owner Rick is a good guy and is up front, and i shouldnt trash talk his shop like i did, but i question his mechanics methods if they missed things that i thought would be obvious. but i understand things happen and people can get distracted, especially when they have 50 cars parked outside that need attention. they are covering the cost of parts, and i could have brought it to them and pointed out what was wrong and they would have fixed it for free. but when it comes to my TDI i don't want to have to worry about anything happening while i'm happily driving down the road so i opted to take it to a specialist. i'm glad it's fixed and this is behind me, i'm not sitting around feeling bitter about it.
 
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