Frustrated with MKIV

BobnOH

not-a-mechanic
Joined
May 29, 2004
Location
central Ohio
TDI
New Beetle 2003 manual
I don't think the hot start fuel map issue on the '99 was fuel level related. It was annoying, just got rid of mine 2 years ago. It didn't do it when new, but gradually it become hard starting any time the motor was warm. Always started though, even with the pathetic batteries I used to use.
I'll try some severe searching for that bidness NV referenced.
 

tgray

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2004
Location
Marengo, IL
TDI
'02 Beetle, '05 Golf, 2000 Jetta, 2001 Jetta, 2002 Jetta
with a half tank no start issue i would first suspect the fuel pickup in the tank. like said above. drop fuel line into diesel can and try starting. pull out thefuel pickup and inspect. could be a broken seal on the pickup tube assembly or i wonder if you have the lines hooked up backward
 

JettaTDISportwagon

Veteran Member
Joined
May 7, 2015
Location
Florida
TDI
2012 SportWagon 6spd Manual TDI ( Gone to the great yard in the sky) 2000 Jetta 5spd TDI 264k Miles and counting 2015 Passat TDI SE DSG Stock for- now...
Im gonna try disconnecting the fuel lines and placing them into a bottle of diesel tonight. Its true I do not know for sure if it was a new or rebuilt pump. Its definitely the shiniest and prettiest spot under my hood. Im starting to think it may be the pickup seal. Manufacture date of the car is 10/99 would that make it a 99.5?
 

JettaTDISportwagon

Veteran Member
Joined
May 7, 2015
Location
Florida
TDI
2012 SportWagon 6spd Manual TDI ( Gone to the great yard in the sky) 2000 Jetta 5spd TDI 264k Miles and counting 2015 Passat TDI SE DSG Stock for- now...
Thank you guys for all of your comments! Its definitely making this a little easier being able to bounce ideas back and forth!
 

JettaTDISportwagon

Veteran Member
Joined
May 7, 2015
Location
Florida
TDI
2012 SportWagon 6spd Manual TDI ( Gone to the great yard in the sky) 2000 Jetta 5spd TDI 264k Miles and counting 2015 Passat TDI SE DSG Stock for- now...
Timing belt looks new! When I changed the fuel filter a couple weeks, It started and ran perfect after I primed the system. I let it run for about 5-10 min. I turned it off to remove the belt cover so i could check and adjust my fuel IQ and I couldn't start again. Ive primed it 4-5 times with no luck replaced the 109 fuse. No start. Im gonna try the "fuel in a bottle" method to rule out the fuel pump tonight.
 

steve6

Veteran Member
Joined
May 25, 2010
Location
Beaverton, ON
TDI
2003 jetta tdi
Timing belt looks new! When I changed the fuel filter a couple weeks, It started and ran perfect after I primed the system. I let it run for about 5-10 min. I turned it off to remove the belt cover so i could check and adjust my fuel IQ and I couldn't start again. Ive primed it 4-5 times with no luck replaced the 109 fuse. No start. Im gonna try the "fuel in a bottle" method to rule out the fuel pump tonight.
I don't want to read back, but how are you 'priming' the system? Are you using a mightyvac or similar to pull fuel through the pump?
 

BobnOH

not-a-mechanic
Joined
May 29, 2004
Location
central Ohio
TDI
New Beetle 2003 manual
I don't want to read back, but how are you 'priming' the system? Are you using a mightyvac or similar to pull fuel through the pump?
I've installed a dry pump twice, both times used only mouth suction to prime pump, cracked injectors, cranked it and they fired right up. If it's not getting a correct prime, there is a leak.
Manufactured date of October 1999 is definitely the 2000 model. My early model 99.5 was made in August 1998.
 

JettaTDISportwagon

Veteran Member
Joined
May 7, 2015
Location
Florida
TDI
2012 SportWagon 6spd Manual TDI ( Gone to the great yard in the sky) 2000 Jetta 5spd TDI 264k Miles and counting 2015 Passat TDI SE DSG Stock for- now...
I primed it both ways. I've cracked the injectors started it. And used a hand vac.
 

JettaTDISportwagon

Veteran Member
Joined
May 7, 2015
Location
Florida
TDI
2012 SportWagon 6spd Manual TDI ( Gone to the great yard in the sky) 2000 Jetta 5spd TDI 264k Miles and counting 2015 Passat TDI SE DSG Stock for- now...
Okay so an update. I hooked the Jetta up to my Denali and towed it around for about 15 min. The car would run and occasionally blow out small black clouds. As soon as I popped the clutch back in it stalls out. When being towed I press the gas pedal and nothing happens. After examining the line, I can see no more air bubbles. Any sugestions? Is there a possibility my fuel timing is way off? Is my fuel pump shot?
 

Andyinchville1

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 7, 2016
Location
Virginia
TDI
2003 Jetta TDI wagon, 5 sp, 226K miles
On TDI's is it possible to remove the fuel shut off solenoid and plug it temporarily to ensure the plunger is not stuck in the fuel cut off position?
 

Rembrant

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2014
Location
Canada's Ocean Playground
TDI
2013 Golf TDI DSG
Timing belt looks new! When I changed the fuel filter a couple weeks, It started and ran perfect after I primed the system. I let it run for about 5-10 min. I turned it off to remove the belt cover so i could check and adjust my fuel IQ and I couldn't start again. Ive primed it 4-5 times with no luck replaced the 109 fuse. No start. Im gonna try the "fuel in a bottle" method to rule out the fuel pump tonight.
Wait a second...

What exactly did you do when you removed the belt cover? What did you adjust?

You would remove the belt cover to adjust the injection timing, but not to adjust the IQ.
 

UhOh

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2014
Location
PNW
TDI
2000 & 2003 Golf GLS (2005 Mercedes E320 CDI)
Nice catch, Rem!

Yup, timing got screwed up. And if OP didn't do it then the IP is likely crapped (never did hear, even with the paperwork, where it came from).
 

Rembrant

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2014
Location
Canada's Ocean Playground
TDI
2013 Golf TDI DSG
Nice catch, Rem!

Yup, timing got screwed up. And if OP didn't do it then the IP is likely crapped (never did hear, even with the paperwork, where it came from).
There were also some comments earlier in this thread about fault codes related to the Injection Pump. I didn't see any updates on that issue. Now, the timing is out of wack...or the pump head is...or both things are.
 

JettaTDISportwagon

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Joined
May 7, 2015
Location
Florida
TDI
2012 SportWagon 6spd Manual TDI ( Gone to the great yard in the sky) 2000 Jetta 5spd TDI 264k Miles and counting 2015 Passat TDI SE DSG Stock for- now...
Sorry for the delay in response. I removed the timing cover to attempt to adjust the injection timing with a VAGCOM. I didn't adjust anything because I couldn't get the car to fire back up after the last attempt of bleeding the air out.
 

JettaTDISportwagon

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Joined
May 7, 2015
Location
Florida
TDI
2012 SportWagon 6spd Manual TDI ( Gone to the great yard in the sky) 2000 Jetta 5spd TDI 264k Miles and counting 2015 Passat TDI SE DSG Stock for- now...
Wait a second...
What exactly did you do when you removed the belt cover? What did you adjust?
You would remove the belt cover to adjust the injection timing, but not to adjust the IQ.

I'm obviously using the wrong terminology in that statement.
 

JettaTDISportwagon

Veteran Member
Joined
May 7, 2015
Location
Florida
TDI
2012 SportWagon 6spd Manual TDI ( Gone to the great yard in the sky) 2000 Jetta 5spd TDI 264k Miles and counting 2015 Passat TDI SE DSG Stock for- now...
The injection timing was never touched. I was hoping to get some solid help from the forum. I guess when these cars have issues like this there bound for the scrap yard. Anyway timing belt is fine. Fuel pump seems to be fine. it shoots fuel out of the cracked injectors.

Any other suggestions?
 

Smokin' Dually

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Joined
Dec 3, 2006
Location
N.E. Wisconsin
TDI
Jetta
Did you try the "fuel in a bottle" trick? My first thought was that there is a pin hole in the line inside the tank. Did your sensor replacement include the whole unit or just a sensor/rheostat?

Where in FL are you located?
 

JettaTDISportwagon

Veteran Member
Joined
May 7, 2015
Location
Florida
TDI
2012 SportWagon 6spd Manual TDI ( Gone to the great yard in the sky) 2000 Jetta 5spd TDI 264k Miles and counting 2015 Passat TDI SE DSG Stock for- now...
Did you try the "fuel in a bottle" trick? My first thought was that there is a pin hole in the line inside the tank. Did your sensor replacement include the whole unit or just a sensor/rheostat?

Where in FL are you located?
I did try the "fuel in a bottle trick" No start. I replaced the whole unit in the tank.
It looks like the send line on the tank sending unit was jerry rigged with a piece of hose and a clamp.

Im located in Sebring
 

Smokin' Dually

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2006
Location
N.E. Wisconsin
TDI
Jetta
OK, that pretty much narrows it down. Remembering the basics: Air & fuel, compression, ignition & ability to exhaust.

Have you checked to see if the anti-shudder valve is open? I've never heard of it sticking shut but it's an easy check.

I know you've said that there is fuel coming out of the lines when you crank it but I'd confirm that the fuel shut off solenoid is opening and staying open. It's in the IP but I don't have the info to test it at hand (on vac in Lakeland). If you can, like mentioned above, hot wire it from the battery to bypass any possible programming issue or other fun Volkswagen circuitry.

The last thing to check is timing which you could somewhat inspect without timing tools. Pop the timing covers off and rotate the crank until the fuel pump timing holes are lined up. Then check to see if the TDC mark on the flywheel is near the pointer on the bellhousing. (that's the important one) Next, pop the vacuum pump off the end of the head and check the alignment of the slot in the end of the camshaft, it should be parallel to the valve cover surface.

If the pump and crank are aligned, the cam probably is too.

This isn't precise but it should give an indication of the timing being off enough to keep it from starting.

None of this has any association to the 1/2 tank issue. It might be worth checking for recalls on your VIN. Those can be checked here: http://www.vw.com/owners/recalls/
 
Last edited:

sisyphus

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2008
Location
Appleton, Maine
TDI
99.5, '01 A4 Jetta sedans, 5 sp box, Hamman mod, Joey mod, Bilsteins, 2.00" lift
Do you have the timing belt tools? You need to verify the mechanical timing between the crank, cam and IP.
 

steve6

Veteran Member
Joined
May 25, 2010
Location
Beaverton, ON
TDI
2003 jetta tdi
I feel like with the mucking around that's been done theres a broken wire somewhere now around the IP, or disconnected something... its just too odd off circumstances
 

RabbitGTI

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 20, 1997
Location
Wisconsin
TDI
B4 Passat Sedan
Fuel cutoff solenoid? Apply 12 volts and see if you get a sharp click each time you jump it. Did not read whole thread, maybe you already tried that.
 

JettaTDISportwagon

Veteran Member
Joined
May 7, 2015
Location
Florida
TDI
2012 SportWagon 6spd Manual TDI ( Gone to the great yard in the sky) 2000 Jetta 5spd TDI 264k Miles and counting 2015 Passat TDI SE DSG Stock for- now...
Fuel cutoff solenoid? Apply 12 volts and see if you get a sharp click each time you jump it. Did not read whole thread, maybe you already tried that.
I tried 12 volts and I hear a click. I'll try to get to checking the timing. I agree with Steve6 I feel like the previous owner had issues that he didn't disclose .

I'll try messing with it again this weekend. Work puts me out of town a lot. I haven't had time to mess with it.
 

Genesis

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 26, 2003
Location
Sevier County TN
TDI
'03 Jetta Wagon
Have you checked to see if the anti-shudder valve is open? I've never heard of it sticking shut but it's an easy check.
Oh yes it does (stick closed)! A friend of mine with a TDI almost had a dealer come get her car over that one.....
 

Nevada_TDI

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 17, 2008
Location
Reno, sort of...
TDI
2001 Jetta TDI
It won't be 100% accurate, but use VCDS and go to the "Timing Check". turn on VCDS, click on Basic Settings (IIRC) go to group 000, hit go, switch to "other mode"--I am sorry I can't remember right this second, click on Timing select proper vehicle >1995/ ALH/etc. and turn engine over. In theory you should see a yellow line on the screen at least in the bottom section. If the yellow line goes past the top too much advance, if there is no yellow line at all the timing is too retarded.
I have read through this post but it has been a couple of days.. what is your IQ set at? You should also be able to get a reading with the engine turning over and see what it says. There are so many knowledgeable people givings suggestions here I can hardly believe the solution hasn't been found yet.
 

UhOh

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Dec 24, 2014
Location
PNW
TDI
2000 & 2003 Golf GLS (2005 Mercedes E320 CDI)
There are so many knowledgeable people givings suggestions here I can hardly believe the solution hasn't been found yet.
Solutions require properly understanding the problem. I think everyone's still working on this part!;)
 

RIP TDI

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 16, 2000
Location
Santa Barbara, CA
TDI
'15 GSW SE 6MT...... '01 Golf GLS 5MT.... '96 Passat Variant....
A couple of mentions of a stuck-closed ASV, but I don't think you said you eliminated it?

I just went through this with an increasingly frequent intermittent no-start. 20K mi. since an ASV/EGR cleaning and it was already starting to stick.
 
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