'12 Passat vs '10+Golf/Jetta mpg

[cristoaca]

Could somebody please explain why is the new Passat TDI getting better fuel economy (according to the owners who posted in "Real World MPG thread" from Passat specific discussion area) than the TDI's Golf or Jetta?
Thank you.

 

[leicaman]

The reason is mainly due to the slightly different emissions system, namely that of Ad-Blue agent that you will need to add at regular intervals. Right now only the Passat has that. The other cars can go without it as the cars are lighter,even though the engine is essentially the same. The '12 has some extra tweaks that make them a little more efficient.

 

[cristoaca]

Thank you.

 

[psd1]

So, even though the numbers look better on paper, the cost of the AD Blue must be factored in to the overall operating cost of the vehicle.

 

[MikeMars]

I think its cheaper than a new DPF

 

[Manyvws]

2012 Passat factory tuning

Could somebody please explain why is the new Passat TDI getting better fuel economy (according to the owners who posted in "Real World MPG thread" from Passat specific discussion area) than the TDI's Golf or Jetta?
Thank you.

Hope this helps
The 2012 Passat's mapping is different than the Jetta's and is enabled do to the Urea injection which lowers NOx gases so,,,,,The passat has more power as it is sort off (chipped) from the factory. VW is being conservative about HP and Torque on this model. Urea tank full lasts about 10,000 miles. Costs around $12.00

I have a 2012 Passat TDI SE with the 6 spd std and just finish a ride from Boston to Portland Maine on sunday. About 107 miles, 90% interstate, 4 adults, 70 mph, straight pump diesel and got 46.4 MPG! This car will easily get 50s plus when broken-in.

 

[GoFaster]

I think its cheaper than a new DPF

For what must be the BAZILLIONTH time on these forms ...

The need for a DPF (controls soot) is independent of the need for AdBlue or other methods of NOx control!

ALL 2007 and later model year diesel engines in on-road vehicles use a DPF.

EVERY.

SINGLE.

ONE.

Inclluding every single one that uses AdBlue. Including every single one that does not. Including every single VW Passat TDI. Including every single Mercedes, BMW, VW, Ford, Dodge, GM, and all sorts of heavier-duty trucks.

 

[GoFaster]

So, even though the numbers look better on paper, the cost of the AD Blue must be factored in to the overall operating cost of the vehicle.

It's true, but the apparent improvement in fuel consumption reduces fuel cost by a fair bit more than what it's going to cost to occasionally refill the AdBlue tank.

 

[psd1]

It's true, but the apparent improvement in fuel consumption reduces fuel cost by a fair bit more than what it's going to cost to occasionally refill the AdBlue tank.

True, but MPG is only one facet in factoring the cost to operate a vehicle. It's easy for folks to forget that the the urea system is there (another thing to go wrong) and that cost of the fluid itself.

 

[MikeMars]

...
The need for a DPF (controls soot) is independent of the need for AdBlue or other methods of NOx control!

ALL 2007 and later model year diesel engines in on-road vehicles use a DPF.
...

Interesting, thanks. (Although for TDIs I'm seeing the year 2009 mentioned elsewhere).

 

[GotEuroCorrado]

My 2006 v10 and my mothers both have dpf...

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk

 

[VWBeamer]

Thanks, it bugs me also. ....but is the urea cheaper than a new HPFP?

For what must be the BAZILLIONTH time on these forms ...

The need for a DPF (controls soot) is independent of the need for AdBlue or other methods of NOx control!

ALL 2007 and later model year diesel engines in on-road vehicles use a DPF.

EVERY.

SINGLE.

ONE.

Inclluding every single one that uses AdBlue. Including every single one that does not. Including every single VW Passat TDI. Including every single Mercedes, BMW, VW, Ford, Dodge, GM, and all sorts of heavier-duty trucks.

 

[VeeDubTDI]

Thanks, it bugs me also. ....but is the urea cheaper than a new HPFP?

Threads turn into HPFP crap quickly enough without this blatant trolling. While it's funny, some idiot will undoubtedly take the bait even if it wasn't intended as bait.

 

[VWBeamer]

Sorry, just joking....half way trolling just because the HPFP sky is falling folks are so much fun!!

 

[NHTDI]

I think the Passat (6M) has different gear ratio's. IIRC a Passat owner stated 2000 rpm at 70mph. That's 300 rpm lower than my 09 Jetta 6M. Lower rpms could be another factor in the improved mpg.
Can't wait to see what these cars will get once broken in and when summer fuel arrives!
drooling...

 

[gergg]

Dang, I can't remember what the rpm's are at 70mph....I'm pretty sure at 65mph it runs around 1750rpm's. I'll pay attention tonight and post the 70mph rpm tomorrow.

 

[740GLE]

I think the Passat (6M) has different gear ratio's. IIRC a Passat owner stated 2000 rpm at 70mph. That's 300 rpm lower than my 09 Jetta 6M. Lower rpms could be another factor in the improved mpg.
Can't wait to see what these cars will get once broken in and when summer fuel arrives!
drooling...

The gearing changed for the 6MT in 2010, dropped RPMS slightly compared to the 2009.

 

[bvencil]

Yeah, seems like my '11 JSW MT is right about 2K RPMs when I am doing 70MPH.

 

[jumpinjoe]

2012 passat dsg is about 65 mph at 2,000 rpm.

 

[gergg]

Passat 6M -6th gear @ 65mph = 1750 rpm's....
@ 70mph = 1825-1850 rpm's

 

[NHTDI]

Passat 6M -6th gear @ 65mph = 1750 rpm's....
@ 70mph = 1825-1850 rpm's

That's a 500 rpm difference compared to 09 Jetta SPW (6M) where mine @ 70mph =2300rpm.
The different gearing can explain the much better highway milage.

 

[dweisel]

Could somebody please explain why is the new Passat TDI getting better fuel economy (according to the owners who posted in "Real World MPG thread" from Passat specific discussion area) than the TDI's Golf or Jetta?
Thank you.

This is from the Study Guide on the 2012 Passat.
The 2012 Passat 6 speed dual clutch transmission is equiped with a FREE WHEEL Function. The purpose of this free wheel function is to isolate the engine from the gearbox in overrun,opening the dual clutch. The engine turns at idling speed and the vehicle coast without any engine braking effect. This freewheel function promotes fuel savings.

As far as the manual transmission I have not read up on it.

 

[greengeeker]

Passat 6M -6th gear @ 65mph = 1750 rpm's....
@ 70mph = 1825-1850 rpm's

Wow. Those are low. Nice.

This is from the Study Guide on the 2012 Passat.
The 2012 Passat 6 speed dual clutch transmission is equiped with a FREE WHEEL Function. The purpose of this free wheel function is to isolate the engine from the gearbox in overrun,opening the dual clutch. The engine turns at idling speed and the vehicle coast without any engine braking effec. This freewheel function promotes fuel savings.

As far as the manual transmission I have not read up on it.

I highly doubt the manual will have this ability if that is what you are hinting at.

 

[GoFaster]

Interesting, thanks. (Although for TDIs I'm seeing the year 2009 mentioned elsewhere).

That's only because there WEREN'T any 2007 or 2008 models (of the types being discussed there).

Original statement still holds: all on-road diesels 2007 model year or later have a DPF, regardless of the method of NOx control.

 

[mysql]

why would the free wheel save fuel during engine braking?

far as I know, engines don't inject fuel during engine braking because the transmission is keeping the engine spinning. Thus no need.

 

[dweisel]

Wow. Those are low. Nice.

I highly doubt the manual will have this ability if that is what you are hinting at.

No, I was refering to the gear ratio in the manual transmission. I don't know if the manual transmission 12 Passat has a higher gear ratio than earlier CR's.

 

[dweisel]

why would the free wheel save fuel during engine braking?

far as I know, engines don't inject fuel during engine braking because the transmission is keeping the engine spinning. Thus no need.

I'm not even going there. Coasting in neutral vs in gear downhill discussion.

 

[IndigoBlueWagon]

The passat has more power as it is sort off (chipped) from the factory. VW is being conservative about HP and Torque on this model.

What data do you have to support this? HP and Torque ratings are the same.

And it appears that the manual transmission Passat is geared similarly to the new Golf/Sportwagen. 2000 RPM in 6th in my golf is 73/74 MPH.

I expect the Golf, when broken in, to deliver mid-40s. I'm averaging 41 now in mostly suburban driving with only 2000 miles on the car.

 

[MikeMars]

That's only because there WEREN'T any 2007 or 2008 models (of the types being discussed there).

Original statement still holds: all on-road diesels 2007 model year or later have a DPF, regardless of the method of NOx control.

I'm really confused. I am finding that on-road diesel vehicles didn't have to have a DPF here until 2009...

2009
http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/fuels-and-environment/diesel-particulate-filters.html

The exhaust emissions standards for new cars have effectively required fitment of a DPF in the exhaust of diesel cars since 2009 when the 'Euro 5' standard came into force. In fact, many cars registered before 2009 will have had one fitted too in anticipation of the change in standards.

And if I look further afield (Australia) they don't seem to be mandatory until 2013 / 2016:
http://www.dieselnet.com/standards/au/
(At least, that's when a watered-down version of the Euro V standards are being phased in there).


Landrover defenders (in Oz) only have the DPF from 2011 onwards
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/90-110-13...sel-particular-filter-yes-no.html#post1563754

... anything built from sept 2011 onwards will have the DPF apparently, along with the smaller 2.2L, all 2.4s have a cat as pictured by bundalene, apparently removing these see's some good performance gains. I cant imagine having a super hot cat sitting right next to the turbo would do much to help heat soak.
...

Regarding 2007, are you talking worldwide, or are you talking about just the USA?