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-   -   Chicago 2009 TDI Owners: Non-Biodiesel Support Group (http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=237849)

Thunderstruck March 5th, 2009 19:56

You got further than I did-they told me "in reference to your inquiry, we're not able to provide you the lists of stations and the type of fuel that they sell.
The only information that we can provide you would be the lists of all stations."
I'm not going to call every fricking Shell station in the area to see what they sell, so I wrote them off at that point.

Sip'n Diesel March 6th, 2009 18:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by littlebike
I sent an email to Shell in this regard, here is their response:

Thank you for bringing your concerns to our attention.

In reference to your inquiry, Shell does not currently sell biodiesel in the Chicago market. The state of Illinois requires any retail diesel dispenser be labeled if it contains biodiesel, with a number that refers to the amount of biodiesel, e.g., B5, B20, etc.

We appreciate the opportunity to serve you in this matter and look forward to providing you with quality Shell branded products and service in the future.

Sincerely,
Shell Customer Care

this is good information! does anyone want to volunteer to send the same questions to BP?

Jetta09Chicago March 16th, 2009 23:10

Speedway Update
 
Since it was recently observed that Speedway stations have been removing biodiesel notices from their pumps, I made an inquiry to the Speedway Super America LLC headquarters in Springfield, Ohio. Today I received the following reply from Jennifer M. Newman:

"Thank you for writing in regard to Bio Diesel and No. 2 ULSD (Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel). At this point we are not selling Bio Diesel. However, we are continually evaluating this decision. We have no plans of going back to selling it at this time. Currently we only offer No. 2 ULSD (Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel) in all of our markets."
Sincerely,
Jennifer
Customer Service

The availability of non-biodiesel at Speedway expands the options available to 2009 TDI owners. I will update the master list.

Please continue to offer info on non-biodiesel pump locations.

UPDATE: As of late spring 2009, several Speedway stations have been confirmed to be selling 6-20% biodiesel blends. This information from the corporate office is no longer correct.

Jetta09Chicago March 16th, 2009 23:25

BP Inquiry
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sip'n Diesel
this is good information! does anyone want to volunteer to send the same questions to BP?

I contacted BP requesting a list of non-biodiesel pumps in the Chicago area. Specifically I requested info on where BP Diesel Supreme and Amoco Premier Diesel can be purchased. I am eager to find out, and will share any info I received.

I have visited BP stations with diesel pumps in Roselle and Carpentersville. Both stations have a single dedicated diesel pump with an Amoco Diesel branding (without Premier). When I asked the cashiers and managers about the type of diesel, no one had a clue. The pumps did not carry any biodiesel labels, although from my experience, I have found this is sometimes a "false negative" as label compliance is spotty.

Does anyone know if this Amoco Diesel represents the variety with the 51 cetane rating?

Jetta09Chicago March 23rd, 2009 10:53

BP Inquiry
 
Does anyone have an e-mail or snail-mail address or phone number to get in touch with BP regarding Chicago-area locations of "premium" BP/Amoco diesel pumps? I have tried using the consumer comments site below on www.alittlebettergasstation.com several times and have received no reply:

http://www.bp.com/heliospower/generi...tentId=7051505

I would like to find out where to purchase the higher-cetane BP diesel fuels around here. Unfortunately BP station attendants have no clue what they are pumping!

ChiTDI March 25th, 2009 08:10

Best route is to catch the tanker truck driver when he's delivering. He'll show you a bill of lading with the delivery requirements. Haven't been able to get anything better than Amoco D2 for about two years around here. Mequon WI is about the closest I've found to have Premier.
Good BP D2 (ULSD) in NW Indiana without Bio is pretty standard there.

Jetta09Chicago March 25th, 2009 22:28

BP Update
 
Today I contacted BP Global Fuels Technology (800-841-5255) and obtained the following information:

1. Chicago-area BP stations generally carry No. 2 diesel, or winterized blends, which come from the Whiting, Indiana, refinery. This fuel has a minimum cetane rating of 40+. Pumps labeled "Amoco Diesel" dispense this standard minimum-cetane product (not 51 as reported elsewhere). Typically BP diesel is available as petrodiesel or low biodiesel (up to B5). On occasion, it is sometimes offered at a higher bio blend (B6-B20), in which case the pump is supposed to carry a disclosure label.

2. BP Diesel Supreme is most widely available at BP stations in Ohio. Its target is actually agriculture, construction and other industrial applications. While it is sometimes offered at service stations, BP has not targeted BP Diesel Supreme at passenger vehicles.

3. Amoco Premier Diesel is another product that BP mainly targets to commercial applications, such as the Chicago Transit Authority, though it sometimes finds its way to service stations. BP does have a list of Chicago-area stations that once carried APD, but they will not share the list since it is outdated. (The person I spoke to believed that APD is available at the BP in Downers Grove.) Once again, pumps labeled "Amoco Diesel" are not APD.

4. Future Product Development - There is now some early-stage discussion about developing a new BP-branded "premium" diesel fuel with a higher cetane rating (47+). No target date has been set for rollout. However, to add a dose of realism, the representative I spoke with predicted that this product would have niche appeal (e.g., TDIClub types), and that distribution would be a great challenge since "jobbers" (service station managers) would need to make a strategic decision between whether to offer a unique premium diesel vs. lower-cost standard No. 2. In most instances, he predicts that jobbers would elect for the cheaper standard diesel which would turn over more frequently.

So based on all this, it would be helpful for people to continue to submit those rare service stations where APD can be found. In addition, I think it would be a good idea to share consumer input with BP and other diesel marketers as to the type of fuel we want them to offer in the future.

Sip'n Diesel March 26th, 2009 13:10

AFAIK the Downers Grove BP gets the same D2 as everyone else:(

FWIW when I was at the auto show I went to the Shell display and asked why Shell offers V-Power diesel up der in ":DCanadia," but not here where we have 10X the population? they didn't have a good answer why but an employee claimed that Shell is considering/planning/developing plans to begin offering V-Power in the States. this would be a premium fuel, of course. I'll believe that when I see it:mad:

SoBeItJetta March 28th, 2009 12:53

Thanks for all your hard work so far in compiling this list. I have been concerned about this too since buying my Jetta TDI last month and reading the owner's manual. I may just have to make the short trek out to Meijer in Bollingbrook when needed. I'm wondering about the Speedway status, though -- I filled up for the first time at the Speedway on 159th St. in Homer Glen and the pump had a "may contain 6-20% biodiesel" sticker on it. Maybe they don't consider that the "Chicago area?"
Anybody know anything about Thornton's or Gas City? Next time I need to fill up, I'll try to check one of them and see if there are stickers on the pump.
There's also a Shell station near Lemont that posts diesel prices on their sign, but that doesn't seem to be coming up on their station locator - it's at the intersection of Archer Ave. and McCarthy Rd.

Sip'n Diesel March 28th, 2009 18:28

I've never used Thornton's or Gas City. I used Meijer several times over the summer, but probably never will again: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=238099

http://www.myturbodiesel.com/forum/i...s/twocents.gifif I had an '09, I would stick to Shell (and maybe BP) exclusively in this area until there is more information available. I think BP has good fuel too, but it may or may not be B6-B20 depending on the station. I find it odd that Speedway stopped offering B11...:confused:
Quote:

Originally Posted by littlebike
I sent an email to Shell in this regard, here is their response:

Thank you for bringing your concerns to our attention.

In reference to your inquiry, Shell does not currently sell biodiesel in the Chicago market. The state of Illinois requires any retail diesel dispenser be labeled if it contains biodiesel, with a number that refers to the amount of biodiesel, e.g., B5, B20, etc.

We appreciate the opportunity to serve you in this matter and look forward to providing you with quality Shell branded products and service in the future.

Sincerely,
Shell Customer Care

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jetta09Chicago
1. Chicago-area BP stations generally carry No. 2 diesel, or winterized blends, which come from the Whiting, Indiana, refinery. This fuel has a minimum cetane rating of 40+. Pumps labeled "Amoco Diesel" dispense this standard minimum-cetane product (not 51 as reported elsewhere). Typically BP diesel is available as petrodiesel or low biodiesel (up to B5). On occasion, it is sometimes offered at a higher bio blend (B6-B20), in which case the pump is supposed to carry a disclosure label.


Jetta09Chicago March 30th, 2009 10:04

SoBeItJetta, welcome to the forum . . .

Your question about Speedway highlights one of the frustrations about finding petrodiesel, namely station operators' lack of compliance in accurately labeling diesel pumps. Some stations are supplying biodiesel and fail to disclose this with a sticker. Other stations have reverted back to petrodiesel and have outdated bio stickers that were not removed. I would suggest that you inquire with your local Speedway manager, and follow up with the corporate office if necessary. Please let us know if this station is pumping bio, as this contradicts what the corporate office told me.

I own a 2009 Jetta TDI with nearly 4,000 miles, and so far I have used only Meijer and Mobil petrodiesel (at Illinois tollway oases). Meijer's corporate office has confirmed non-bio content. Mobil oasis cashiers have stated that they supply D2, which is also printed on receipts. Personally I have decided to save my fuel receipts just in case any future issues arise.

Sip'n Diesel March 30th, 2009 11:39

I have some Speedway receipts (one location in particular) from several months ago which say B11, when all Speedways were supposedly selling it. I stopped using Speedway when, to my confusion, the receipts started to say D2. this was around the time when winter was starting to get really cold. I suspect they stopped selling B11 due to the extreme cold temps, or possibly for other reasons:confused:

maybe I'll dig through the stack of receipts and try to pinpoint a date, or does anyone already know why they stopped offering B11?

Sip'n Diesel March 30th, 2009 12:01

Fwiw
 
here's a screen-shot of all Shell locations on my Favorites list @ http://www.gasbuddy.com

all of these stations usually have pretty competitive prices. except, for the one off I-90 in Elgin. don't go to the Elgin one! they are @ $2.99 AFAIK, diesel has probably been sitting in their tank since October:p. the Addison location is almost always more expensive than the Lombard location, which is right down the street. there are many industrial businesses and a major UPS facility nearby, so that's why I would disqualify Addison from being a "high volume" station

I suspect the "high volume" stations would be: both in Aurora, Lombard, and Mokena, as they are all located on major truck routes/interstate exits. I've never been stuck using a truck-sized nozzle @ Shell either, some have them but they all have auto sized nozzles as well. I don't go to Shell nearly as much as I used to (RE: 5% cash-back @ BP) otherwise I would have more locations on my list:
http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/l...MISC/shell.jpg

Jetta09Chicago April 2nd, 2009 14:24

Shell Diesel
 
I contacted one of the Shell stations closest to me (2449 West Lake Street near Medinah Road in Addison) and inquired about their diesel product. The attendant checked and stated that it is a biodiesel blend. I asked the percentage of bio content, but she did not know.

I explained that my car requires no more than B5, so she spoke with another employee, who said that their biodiesel is the "same as all the other Shells in this area."

I put in a call to Shell (888-467-4355) and left a message asking for clarification of biodiesel content, as well as the current cetane rating in the Chicago area. Based on a previous post, it seemed that Shell was non-bio in this market, but now the local station is telling me otherwise.

In my experience, stations which offer biodiesel most commonly supply B11. However, I wonder if Shell might be using <B5 merely for lubricity benefits. If I learn more, I will post here.

Jetta09Chicago April 7th, 2009 18:06

Shell Update
 
Today I received two e-mails from Shell Customer Care regarding separate inquiries I submitted. My first question was on biodiesel content in the Chicago market:


"Currently the Chicago diesel product for Shell is just petroleum diesel, no biodiesel. The cetane rating will be at least 40."


Shell's second reply addresses a separate question I raised about their cetane rating. There is an oft-quoted chart on the message boards here reporting a certain cetane value for Shell diesel.


"Shell is not currently marketing any premium diesel so we do not guarantee those properties for any diesel. In some northern areas of the US Shell will supply a winter diesel from October through March that contains an additive to improve cold weather performance."


So these are Shell's corporate responses. There is apparently miscommunication between the corporate and retailer levels. For example, the Shell station at 2449 West Lake Street in Addison recently told me that they carry biodiesel (percentage unkown), "the same diesel sold at all the Shells in this area." However, the corporate e-mail claims what they are selling is petrodiesel. In any event, it does not hurt for us 2009 TDI owners to examine the pumps for biodiesel labels and also talk to the employees.


UPDATE: As of 5/8/09, this statement from Shell Customer Care is inaccurate. The Shell station at Oakton and Busse in Elk Grove Village displays pump stickers indicating 6-20% biodiesel.


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